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  • [00:00:33] * Topic is 'http://beagleboard.org/chat has a guide on how to ask questions and links to the logs | never ask to ask, just ask | be patient | pastebin a boot log | http://ahsoftware.de/Beaglebone_Black_Boot_explained.svg | BBB is being sold faster than produced. Order one and wait. There is no other way. | http://beagleboard.org/latest-images | http://beagleboard.org/Support/bone101'
  • [00:00:33] * Set by KotH!~attila@lou-outside.kinali.ch on Fri Sep 12 15:14:32 UTC 2014
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  • [03:44:22] <ecdhe> bbb was shipped to me with debian on it. There are no devices like /dev/spidev0.0; how do I enable the first SPI port?
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  • [04:32:31] <yates> if i'm running off the external microSD, and it has enough room for a new .img, is there a way to transfer that new .img to the bbb's filesystem and then use it to reflash the microSD "in place"?
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  • [04:33:20] <yates> the method cannot utilize the internal emmc because my cape is using the mmc1 signals for other purposes.
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  • [04:39:07] <av500> yates: why not just swap the SD card?
  • [04:39:50] <yates> the whole idea is to avoid requiring physical access, e.g., to be able to update remotely.
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  • [04:41:57] <av500> sure its possible, its "just" SW after all
  • [04:42:05] <av500> and PC systems update themselves
  • [04:42:07] <yates> right. :)
  • [04:42:11] <av500> its just work
  • [04:42:15] <yates> exactly.
  • [04:42:32] <av500> just make 2 partitions and have the boot loader pick the right one
  • [04:42:34] <yates> seems like this is a nut that may have already been cracked.
  • [04:42:41] <av500> is one way
  • [04:42:54] <av500> or dont use .img files, but update only what changed
  • [04:43:01] <av500> like a linux distro does
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  • [04:43:17] <av500> and most of all, worry about what can go wrong
  • [04:43:22] <av500> that dwarfs everything else
  • [04:43:34] <yates> yup, yup, yup. i agree 101 %
  • [04:43:58] <yates> it's not a big deal, but if it could be easily done, it Would Be Nice(TM)
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  • [04:44:05] <av500> easily, no
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  • [04:44:27] <yates> ok, thanks av500
  • [04:44:30] <av500> also, what about local "settings"?
  • [04:44:38] <av500> if you write an img, they are lost
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  • [04:45:06] <yates> well, not really - you control the img, right?
  • [04:45:18] <yates> make sure they're there before you download the new .img.
  • [04:45:25] <yates> but good caveat
  • [04:45:28] <av500> thats one way
  • [04:46:09] <av500> its just more things that can go wrong :)
  • [04:46:17] <yates> well enough said about it. my client has a unit that is about 40 miles from their workplace, but they're just gonna have to take a drive...
  • [04:46:38] <av500> and if its just for one unit, well, tough luck :)
  • [04:46:44] <yates> right.
  • [04:46:49] <yates> i was just inquiring..
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  • [05:34:31] <ds2> upgrade is trivial. just kiss your data good bye and pull the trigger
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  • [05:50:16] <ecdhe> If I want to enable a device tree overlay, I can do this: echo BB-SPI1-01 > /sys/devices/bone_capemgr.*/slots
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  • [05:50:25] <ecdhe> What do I do to disable it?\
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  • [06:26:27] <biru> hi, everyone
  • [06:27:16] <biru> i'm having problem when upgrading debian kernel on BB black
  • [06:27:47] <biru> i followed the instruction from: http://elinux.org/Beagleboard:BeagleBoneBlack_Debian#Kernel_Upgrade
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  • [06:28:43] <biru> and got this message at the end of the command line: ERROR: The certificate of `rcn-ee.net' is not trusted.
  • [06:29:15] <biru> Can anyone please help to resolve this problem? thanks
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  • [06:36:39] <biru> sorry, forgot to mention... i've got the error message when running command: sudo ./update_kernel.sh
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  • [11:03:06] <mrph> Hi. I have problems setting up my can network interface at startup using /etc/network/interfaces. At startup the interface is visible with ifconfig -a but not without the -a option. That means it is not activated although I use ifconfig can0 up. My machine is a beaglebone black. Here is my /etc/network/interfaces: http://pastebin.com/bZMYUuGh
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  • [11:47:35] <_rotti> hi
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  • [11:55:11] <tbr> mooo
  • [11:56:48] <KotH> magi suppe servelat, ufm bergli gling gling gling stoht e chue und treit de grind!
  • [11:57:30] <tbr> KotH: was there lsd in your early grey tea?
  • [11:57:53] <KotH> tbr: it might have been lunch
  • [11:58:17] <tbr> lsd laced lunch, interesting places you go...
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  • [12:01:23] <KotH> you should know by now, that i've been to places where no sane man would go
  • [12:03:43] <_rotti> KotH: is that swiss?
  • [12:04:15] <KotH> _rotti: if you have to ask, then the answer is no
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  • [13:11:10] <Boneille> Does anybody knows how exactly the communication works between my Chrome Browser and my Beagle board? Or can explain it for me?
  • [13:12:16] <KotH> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertext_Transfer_Protocol
  • [13:13:50] <Boneille> and it works only if i have my usb plugged in my board?
  • [13:15:34] <KotH> well... you know how netorking, ie TCP/IP based protocols work?
  • [13:15:45] <KotH> if not, get a book on networking
  • [13:16:13] * mhaberler (~mhaberler@89.201.163.12) Quit (Quit: mhaberler)
  • [13:19:50] <Boneille> Thank you very much
  • [13:21:18] <KotH> Boneille: es gibt eine ep von der sendung mit der maus, die tcp/ip recht gut erklärt
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  • [13:25:11] <Boneille> okay hahaha vielen Dank =)
  • [13:25:31] <Boneille> dann sollte ich es auch verstehen
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  • [13:25:53] <KotH> Boneille: lach nicht. das zeugs ist gut :)
  • [13:26:26] <Boneille> okay, vielen dank klingt echt gut werde es mir gleich mal anschauen, danke dir nochmals!
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  • [15:22:14] <ecdhe> I'm on the BBB, and the python code 'spi = SPI(0,0)' fails when not run as root.
  • [15:22:44] <ecdhe> I have correctly chown/chgrp/chmoded /dev/spidev1.0 for the user...
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  • [15:47:14] <poxin> hey folks, just got a beaglebone black, following the getting started guide. Can I flash an img file to the onboard storage instead of using an SD Card somehow?
  • [15:47:36] <jkridner> poxin: there are 2 images on http://beagleboard.org/latest-images ....
  • [15:47:51] <jkridner> both are meant to be written to a microSD card, but one will flash the on-board eMMC when booted.
  • [15:48:10] <jkridner> It is possible to flash w/o a microSD card, but it requires some expertise
  • [15:48:40] <poxin> Ah okay, so the img goes to the sd card and that flashes the onboard?
  • [15:48:57] <poxin> I have the eMMC flasher img downloaded
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  • [16:04:29] <ecdhe> Why does my adafruit spi code run only as root?
  • [16:04:44] <ecdhe> /dev/spidev1.0 is owned by the user.
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  • [16:05:16] <ecdhe> /usr/local/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/Adafruit_BBIO/SPI.so is also owned by the user.
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  • [16:07:44] <ecdhe> So the device in /dev, and the python library file are both owned by the user...
  • [16:07:56] <ecdhe> Why would I need to run the code as root?
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  • [17:04:22] <ecdhe> I figured it out: running an strace on python showed that when you instantiate a SPI handle, it tries to open /sys/devices/bglcapemgr.*/slots in 'R/W' mode.
  • [17:05:23] <ecdhe> By changing it's permissions from "root root 644" to "root users 664" I was able to execute my python SPI code without running as root.
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  • [19:36:50] <ecdhe> I have a BBB and the SPI is clocked at ~23.8 MHz.
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  • [19:36:55] <ecdhe> How can I slow that down?
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  • [20:16:13] <ecdhe> This room is not very helpful!
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  • [20:20:21] <djlewis> perhaps all 278 people are out to lunch ;)
  • [20:22:48] * Vasco is now known as Vasco_O
  • [20:23:26] <vagrantc> ecdhe: you asked a question less than an hours ago...
  • [20:24:06] <ecdhe> I've been asking unanswered questions for about 20 hours now.
  • [20:24:23] <vagrantc> i guess also more longer ago
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  • [20:24:50] * ogra_ has been answering unanswered questions his whole life ...
  • [20:24:59] <vagrantc> ecdhe: maybe... nobody knows the answer to your question
  • [20:25:07] <vagrantc> that doesn't make it unhelper
  • [20:25:09] <vagrantc> unhelper
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  • [20:25:12] <vagrantc> gah.
  • [20:25:15] <vagrantc> unhelpful
  • [20:25:24] <_av500_> I like to unhelp
  • [20:26:01] <vagrantc> see. positive attitude.
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  • [20:27:16] <KotH> ecdhe: well... you are asking questions without providing information
  • [20:27:21] * KotH sets mode -o KotH
  • [20:27:29] <KotH> ecdhe: you are not getting much help that way
  • [20:27:38] <KotH> ecdhe: also, you should learn unix basics
  • [20:28:14] <KotH> ecdhe: i'm also pretty sure that the documentation tells you how to set the spi clock speed
  • [20:29:43] <ecdhe> KotH, which documentation?
  • [20:30:44] <ecdhe> I was able to eventually find the device tree overlay file, and believed it to be responsible for the speed.
  • [20:30:46] <KotH> spi? trm? ...
  • [20:30:55] <ecdhe> But I couldn't find the dts file it was compiled from.
  • [20:31:07] <ecdhe> So I eventually also found a dts file online.
  • [20:31:31] <ecdhe> Typically, SPI speed is configured in hardware through a register value, so you have to round...
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  • [20:32:05] <ecdhe> You can just set your speed to 10,382 hz exactly, it gets rounded to the nearest closest clock division.
  • [20:32:37] <ecdhe> So I wasn't sure if I could just set '10000000' in the uncompiled device tree overlay, or if there was a table of values somewhere that I would need to choose from.
  • [20:33:37] <ecdhe> So I tried the value and compiled it, copied it to /lib/firmware and echoed it into /sys/devices/bone_capemgr.*/slots
  • [20:33:58] <KotH> have you read the TRM?
  • [20:34:12] <ecdhe> It seems to work, but I've been googling for hours and haven't run across a manual on this.
  • [20:34:37] <KotH> well.. have you looked into Documentation/ ?
  • [20:34:55] <KotH> especially Documentation/spi and Documentation/*/devicetree
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  • [20:39:20] <ecdhe> KotH, do you mean on beagleboard.org?
  • [20:39:27] <KotH> no
  • [20:39:30] <KotH> kernel docu
  • [20:39:38] <ecdhe> link?\
  • [20:39:39] <KotH> where all the documentation you ever need, is
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  • [20:39:52] <KotH> /path/to/your/kernel/sources/
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  • [21:22:45] <agmlego> ecdhe: WHat library are you using with what language to do SPI?
  • [21:23:10] <ecdhe> python+Adafruit
  • [21:23:31] <agmlego> Because py-spi has really simple ways to set the SPI bus clock rate.
  • [21:23:41] <agmlego> Adafruit...what?
  • [21:23:50] <agmlego> She has like 400 libraries.
  • [21:24:33] <ecdhe> adafruit BBIO
  • [21:24:42] <agmlego> Ah.
  • [21:24:53] <agmlego> So, what does her documentation say about chaning the SPI clock rate?
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  • [21:26:20] <ecdhe> It wasn't disclosed by the library docs, but there is a page on device tree showing the code used to set it at ~24Mhz.
  • [21:27:01] <agmlego> Why would you go to device tree to set something your chosen library does already?
  • [21:27:12] <ecdhe> Because the library doesn't do it.
  • [21:27:24] <agmlego> ( source/spimodule.c:52 )
  • [21:27:27] <agmlego> Yes, it does.
  • [21:28:06] <agmlego> SPI.msh is the current max speed in Hz.
  • [21:29:57] <agmlego> Here is how I discovered this, never having used the library:
  • [21:30:14] <agmlego> 1. Google: "adafruit_bbio spi clock"
  • [21:30:38] <agmlego> 2. Quick analysis of top several tutorials all referring to a "msh" attribute of the SPI module.
  • [21:30:44] * gustavoz (~gustavoz@186.18.128.65) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
  • [21:30:54] <agmlego> 3. Github: Adafruit_BBIO: Search repository for "msh"
  • [21:31:38] <agmlego> 4. Result: source/spimodule.c:52 yields "uint32_t msh;/* current SPI max speed setting in Hz */"
  • [21:32:18] <agmlego> 5. Now I know that the "msh" attribute of the SPI module is the current maximum clock rate, in Hz, for the bus controlled by the module.
  • [21:33:38] <agmlego> Note that this process was started at "17:25 < agmlego> Why would you go to device tree..." and ended at "17:26 < agmlego> ( source/spimodule.c:52 )"
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  • [21:34:02] <ecdhe> Thanks agmlego!
  • [21:34:05] <agmlego> ecdhe: The reason I am laying this all out very plainly like this is threefold.
  • [21:34:38] <agmlego> 1. Many people fail to understand how to put the principles in the guide on how to ask smart questiosn the right way to use.
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  • [21:34:47] <agmlego> 2. Many people fail to read the guide at all.
  • [21:35:07] <agmlego> 3. I am waiting for a statistical simulation to complete at work and I have literally nothing better to do.
  • [21:35:45] <agmlego> ecdhe: Expectations that all interactions with support fora like this one will go the way this one did should not be maintained.
  • [21:36:00] <ecdhe> agmlego, I see that I can improve my IRC question quality.
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  • [21:36:30] <agmlego> Yes, and a really really good place to start? Is reading the topic, and all the links therein.
  • [21:36:30] <ecdhe> I understand that you were really holding my hand there.
  • [21:36:32] <agmlego> ;-P
  • [21:36:44] <agmlego> (really, really, really holding)
  • [21:37:01] <ecdhe> agmlego, earlier, I had a two liner that wouldn't run without root:
  • [21:37:05] <ecdhe> from Adafruit_BBIO.SPI import SPI
  • [21:37:05] <ecdhe> spi = SPI(0,0)
  • [21:37:24] <ecdhe> And asked in here why that might be -- but then I kept poking.
  • [21:37:43] <agmlego> I saw your questions about that, when I scrolled up to verify your claim of asking questions for 20 hours.
  • [21:37:48] <ecdhe> I ran strace on the code -- and discovered that the adafruit library actually tries to install it's own overlay.
  • [21:38:03] <agmlego> (which is how such things work)
  • [21:38:22] <ecdhe> So before you run it, there are no spidev*.* devices in /dev -- and after you run your code, there they are.
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  • [21:38:47] <ecdhe> So I was able to change the permissions on the slots file and get it working.
  • [21:38:48] <agmlego> WHich is how overlays work, yes.
  • [21:39:09] <ecdhe> *get it working without having to run as root.
  • [21:39:56] <agmlego> Sure.
  • [21:39:58] <ecdhe> This is also how I work--when 10 minutes of googling fails me, I ask a question on IRC.
  • [21:40:12] <ecdhe> But when IRC fails, I google.
  • [21:40:20] <ecdhe> After a few hours, I get it.
  • [21:40:40] <agmlego> Another way you could do it is to have sensible privilege escalation in your program, and run only the part needing higher privileges when you need to.
  • [21:40:52] <agmlego> ecdhe: And yet...
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  • [21:41:09] <ecdhe> As I learn, I start to be able to field the questions that others have, and I contribute back.
  • [21:42:04] <ecdhe> To me, the beauty of IRC is that one volunteer can save another one 3-4 hours of googling.
  • [21:43:01] <ecdhe> Like your github mention -- you really saved me some time there, because the only docs I had for BBIO SPI were python's dir() and this page: https://learn.adafruit.com/search?q=bbio+spi
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  • [21:43:41] <agmlego> Well, that just comes from knowing that the ultimate documentation for a piece of software is the software's source code.
  • [21:44:06] <agmlego> And you will be handed that line here regularly: "Did you read the source? Did you read the docs?"
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