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  • [02:53:47] <zoolu> how a USB device is plugged in, how does the VFS in the kernel know the FS-type and the driver to do the mount?
  • [02:53:55] <zoolu> *when a USB device
  • [02:54:35] <zoolu> Just wondering, because there is nothing in fstab
  • [02:54:46] <zoolu> Super block signature?
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  • [06:48:51] <koen> ds2: it does, I used OE on a nslu2 and harald welte used to use it on his G5 powermac
  • [06:48:54] <koen> "Support for ARMv7a, Thumb 2, Neon, and SMP are being added to GCC 4.7"
  • [06:49:14] * koen should stop reading linaro press releases^H^H^^H interviews
  • [06:50:31] <av500> ooh, neon
  • [06:51:09] <koen> " Standardizing on the OpenMax media libraries [..] is the direction that Linaro is going."
  • [06:51:18] <av500> in gcc?
  • [06:51:32] <av500> stromxcmp?
  • [06:51:42] <koen> fast_omxcopy
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  • [06:52:34] <av500> ...Device manufacturers are no longer happy to get a board support package (BSP) that is out of date and requires a BSP-specific toolchain....
  • [06:52:42] <av500> as bsp specific toolchain? wtf?
  • [06:52:57] <av500> gcc_omap?
  • [06:54:37] <av500> ...Support for ARMv7a, Thumb 2, Neon, and SMP are being added to GCC 4.7, which won't be released until April 2012, and won't get into distributions until October 2012
  • [06:54:53] <av500> omg, what will we be doing until then?
  • [06:58:21] <koen> how did we ever get things done in the past without linaro?
  • [06:58:42] <av500> one does really wonder
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  • [09:38:08] <av500> http://correlate.googlelabs.com/search?e=omap3&t=weekly#
  • [09:38:22] <av500> hmm, blondie or brownie?
  • [09:41:58] <AxMountain> haha
  • [10:12:24] <koen> DRAM: 128 MiB
  • [10:12:24] <koen> NAND: 512 MiB
  • [10:12:26] <koen> hmmm
  • [10:12:30] * koen wonders
  • [10:12:48] <woglinde> *g*
  • [10:14:32] <av500> koen: revB7?
  • [10:24:51] <koen> C5
  • [10:25:09] <av500> well, swap to nand ftw
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  • [10:37:47] <Crofton> urg
  • [10:37:53] <Crofton> too much sun
  • [10:38:23] <koen> Crofton: you google latitude is hilarious at times
  • [10:39:50] <Crofton> why?
  • [10:39:55] <Crofton> Out in the sound?
  • [10:39:59] <koen> yes
  • [10:40:03] <Crofton> It is correct
  • [10:40:32] <koen> yes, but the satelite pics don't show the boat
  • [10:40:40] <Crofton> http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=200915686948109237984.0004a41fe72b8d1f70099&ll=35.335013,-75.528088&spn=0.091305,0.127029&t=h&z=13
  • [10:40:44] <Crofton> rofl
  • [10:41:35] <Crofton> This one is hilarious to everyone but me
  • [10:41:36] <Crofton> http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=200915686948109237984.0004a3f7145099b884d64&t=h&z=14
  • [10:42:26] <Crofton> any advice on how one of our customers can find a FAE to give them a hand with a JTAG and a Tide
  • [10:42:46] <Crofton> they have done a bunch of reasonable stuff and it is not working
  • [10:43:26] <Crofton> koen, look at facebook
  • [10:45:26] <mru> hey texans, how much time does one need to change flights in dallas?
  • [10:45:47] <Crofton> depends how many guns you have
  • [10:45:56] <mru> just the one shotgun
  • [10:46:38] <mru> I'm being offered a connection with 1h10 to change
  • [10:46:44] <mru> seems a bit tight
  • [10:47:07] <Crofton> with the shotgun you shuld be able to shoot right through
  • [10:47:36] <mru> the trip in question is austin-dallas-lhr
  • [10:48:16] <av500> mru: do a stop in dallas and put the shotgun to good use
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  • [10:50:53] <Crofton> austin?
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  • [10:51:08] <Crofton> jkridner, how was hte maker faire
  • [10:56:14] <mru> Crofton: some linaro meeting they want me to attend
  • [10:56:48] <av500> ha, you sold out to the dark side!
  • [10:57:34] <av500> mru: maybe they want you to add armv7a support to gcc for 2012?
  • [10:58:18] <Crofton> seems like a hard place to get to
  • [10:59:28] <mru> not really
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  • [11:04:21] <mru> this is absurd, same flight is ??700 cheaper booked with american airlines rather than BA
  • [11:04:49] <mru> and yes, it's showing the price in pounds
  • [11:05:57] * topfs2 (~topfs2@xbmc/staff/topfs2) has joined #beagle
  • [11:06:45] <av500> mru: its steak vs kidney pie
  • [11:07:03] <mru> av500: it's the same BA aircraft
  • [11:07:18] <av500> yes, but the cattle section
  • [11:07:43] <mru> is there really a difference?
  • [11:08:05] <av500> more space in the cattle section, due to animal rights activists
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  • [11:12:30] <damjan> once I have OE/Angstrom compiled how can I compile a hello-world.c example?
  • [11:13:55] <koen> Crofton: heh
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  • [12:04:12] <_av500_> damjan: you write an elaborate recipe
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  • [12:09:09] <woglinde> damjan pathtocrosscompiletoolchain/arm-bla-gcc -o fooexample hello-world.c
  • [12:09:38] <damjan> damn, I f*cked my build dir
  • [12:09:53] <damjan> let's start from the begining :)
  • [12:09:55] <woglinde> try again
  • [12:09:59] <woglinde> next time harder
  • [12:10:13] <damjan> :)
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  • [12:22:25] <tasslehoff> I have a shell script that reads board revision from the gpio's. That broke when I upgraded to new u-boot/.37-kernel. Both u-boot and the kernel reads the pins just fine, but "echo 171 > /sys/class/gpio/export" doesn't work anymore.
  • [12:23:07] <_av500_> maybe 171 is now owned by some other driver
  • [12:23:24] <woglinde> jupp
  • [12:23:31] <woglinde> check the code
  • [12:23:58] * tasslehoff does, but must do a better search this time
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  • [12:29:18] <tasslehoff> hm. could it be because omap3_beagle_init_rev does not free the pins? shouldn't it do that?
  • [12:29:19] <plm> Hi all
  • [12:29:23] * tasslehoff thinks it should
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  • [13:39:49] <wet3> We're trying to use DSP Bridge (via DSP for Dummies) to run some code on the DSP. Occasionally, the DSP will get into a state where it stops responding until we reboot the BeagleBoard. dmesg shows these messages on repeat:
  • [13:39:56] <wet3> wait_for_start: Timed out waiting DSP to Start
  • [13:40:00] <wet3> proc_start: dsp in running state
  • [13:40:05] <wet3> omap-dsp omap-dsp: bridge_deh_notify: DSP_WDTOVERFLOW
  • [13:40:09] <wet3> omap-dsp omap-dsp: ERR: clock id 1 already disabled
  • [13:40:12] <wet3> omap-dsp omap-dsp: ERR: clock id 2 already disabled
  • [13:40:15] <wet3> proc_load: Processor Loaded /lib/dsp/baseimage.dof
  • [13:40:35] <wet3> Does anyone know how to prevent the DSP from getting into that state and/or how to recover from it once it's in it?
  • [13:41:15] <av500> dont make it go into that state
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  • [13:42:48] <woglinde> dsp-bridge again
  • [13:43:02] <av500> its a troubled bridge over water
  • [13:44:28] <woglinde> wet try dsplink
  • [13:44:58] <av500> crashing the dsp is as easy there
  • [13:45:32] <wet3> Would C6Run be a better approach to offloading some of our code to the DSP?
  • [13:46:11] <wet3> Specifically, we'd like to get some of the OpenCV functions that are taxing the ARM to run on the DSP instead.
  • [13:46:18] <av500> of course
  • [13:46:22] <av500> we knew that :)
  • [13:46:36] <av500> when it stops responding, did it finish the task?
  • [13:47:24] <wet3> Yeah, it does seem to have finished the task it was doing. So maybe something's going wrong in the cleanup?
  • [13:51:01] <whatnick> hey wet3
  • [13:51:14] * whatnick always gets interested with opencv dsp talk
  • [13:51:35] <whatnick> one of the projects did some benchmarking it wasn't much better ..
  • [13:51:40] <whatnick> with the dsp
  • [13:53:03] <pictureaday> was it worse?
  • [13:53:18] <pictureaday> and what algorithms were being optimized to run on the dsp
  • [13:53:32] <whatnick> https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ai2Dm5P92uZhdGFxcnI0N3p3M3FKX09XaVdwak4takE&hl=en&authkey=CIyT35UE#gid=0
  • [13:54:05] <whatnick> http://code.google.com/p/opencv-dsp-acceleration/
  • [13:55:35] <pictureaday> interesting
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  • [14:01:39] <pictureaday> Sure the results look like that when there is nothing else being processed, but suppose there is a moderate load on the cpu, then the results would show a much greater contrast no?
  • [14:03:57] <wet3> We're using this: http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/Beagle_Board_Challenge:_SuperBeagle We're using the matrix multiplication test case, and for the DSP-optimized algorithm, we're seeing the DSP surpass the ARM chip at larger matrix sizes (e.g. 256x256). At smaller matrix sizes, the ARM is faster.
  • [14:04:21] <av500> makes sense
  • [14:04:32] <wet3> We haven't actually tested the OpenCV code on the DSP yet. We're working toward that point.
  • [14:04:40] <av500> and you could do part of the matrix mult on the IMX
  • [14:05:32] <av500> wet3: sadly, the situation around dspbridge is that apart from the TI android team and nokia, nobody cares for it
  • [14:05:51] <av500> and nokia does not care much either since they are a DirectX shop now
  • [14:07:11] <woglinde> *g*
  • [14:07:17] <woglinde> c6accel
  • [14:07:34] <woglinde> but opencv
  • [14:07:48] <woglinde> I should really make consulting about it
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  • [14:08:17] * av500 hides behing a fridge running e17
  • [14:08:33] <woglinde> hi raster
  • [14:11:42] <raster> mrlmrlrm!
  • [14:12:15] * dvhart (~dvhart@static-50-53-93-249.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  • [14:13:41] * mranostay sips coffee and scrolls up
  • [14:13:55] <wet3> Hmm...maybe we should give DSPLink another try (perhaps in conjuction with C6Run), then. We're seeing good performance improvements, but the process to make them happen seems overly complicated.
  • [14:14:06] <woglinde> wet6 c6accel
  • [14:14:13] <av500> c6easy
  • [14:14:19] <av500> c6medium_raw
  • [14:14:25] <av500> so many....
  • [14:15:06] <whatnick> sick of c6 at sea
  • [14:15:35] <av500> wet3: so you call your stuff over and over again and suddenly it stops?
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  • [14:21:30] <wet3> We're still trying to figure out the pattern. Sometimes it runs over and over with no problems. In this case, I was trying out some new code. It completed, but the next time I ran it, the DSP wouldn't respond. So I'm thinking maybe something in the cleanup is going wrong.
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  • [15:49:44] <Ali_> Hi Guys
  • [15:50:00] <Ali_> Does anyone know if windows ce 6.0 support SATA disks
  • [15:50:39] <Ali_> I have windows ce 6.0 but cant get it to see the SATA disk drive
  • [15:50:42] <woglinde> with a right driver it should
  • [15:50:56] <prpplague> Ali_: yes it does, but this really isn't the channel for window ce support
  • [15:50:58] <woglinde> but dont expect such a driver
  • [15:51:08] <Ali_> alright ok
  • [15:51:12] <prpplague> Ali_: you will be hard pressed to find someone who does wince dev here
  • [15:51:24] <Ali_> I am looking to right this driver myself any idea how to start this
  • [15:51:49] <av500> since when does the BB have sata?
  • [15:51:50] <prpplague> Ali_: will this be for working on the beagleboard?
  • [15:52:13] <Ali_> just got a contract opportunity and i am quite happy to share the money with someone who can guide me through this.
  • [15:52:38] <Ali_> Say forexample it is
  • [15:52:44] <av500> could I buy a boat?
  • [15:53:06] <prpplague> Ali_: does this have to do with beagleboard?
  • [15:54:23] <Ali_> yes
  • [15:54:31] <av500> and the BB has sata?
  • [15:54:39] <av500> mine has not
  • [15:54:43] * av500 asks for a refund
  • [15:54:43] <Ali_> yes connected to it
  • [15:54:54] <av500> i2c or spi?
  • [15:54:57] <Ali_> through USB
  • [15:55:03] <Ali_> SPI
  • [15:55:08] <av500> so why do you need a sata driver?
  • [15:55:21] <av500> all the BB sees is a USB hdd
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  • [15:55:57] <Ali_> I am not sure yet i have meeting with client today so was making some gusses
  • [15:56:22] <prpplague> Ali_: wince already has a usb mass storage driver
  • [15:56:25] <prpplague> Ali_: nothing to do
  • [15:56:43] <av500> prpplague: quiet, there goes my boat!!!
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  • [16:04:26] <wmat> jkridner|work: how does news find its way into the BeagleBoard.org/news feed?
  • [16:04:53] * htns (~htns@61.6.64.6) Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
  • [16:06:40] <woglinde> av500 no boat
  • [16:06:51] <av500> damn
  • [16:07:00] <woglinde> and no sata
  • [16:07:03] <woglinde> thats life
  • [16:12:26] <tasslehoff> should omap3_beagle_init_rev free the gpio pins it uses, or should it be allowed to own the revision pins for ever and ever?
  • [16:12:47] <woglinde> depends on the gpio?
  • [16:13:25] <tasslehoff> woglinde: it's three pins that are used for board revision, so I can't see what else they would be used for
  • [16:13:55] <tasslehoff> they are freed only if requesting one of them fails.
  • [16:14:13] <woglinde> oh only rev
  • [16:14:31] <woglinde> hm than they should be maybee freed
  • [16:14:59] <woglinde> but I dont know if you can harm something when you use the wrong setup using /sys/gpioclass
  • [16:15:11] <woglinde> ask koen
  • [16:15:42] <Russ> /sys/class/gpio/
  • [16:15:45] <tasslehoff> will do. koen ^^^ :)
  • [16:15:59] <woglinde> russ yes yes ...
  • [16:17:04] <jkridner|work> wmat: I feed it through Google Reader's shared items...
  • [16:17:06] <koen> I didn't write that code, it's from upstream :)
  • [16:17:23] <jkridner|work> I subscribe to blogs that post anything about the BeagleBoard and when I read them, I share them if they are an interesting topic...
  • [16:17:29] <av500> BB has an upstream?
  • [16:17:33] <av500> canineboard?
  • [16:17:43] <woglinde> av500 noz?
  • [16:17:47] <av500> which upstream to mamlboard?
  • [16:17:50] <av500> mamal
  • [16:17:56] <jkridner|work> I subscribe to some Google Alerts on BeagleBoard and some spelling variants to try to discover new blogs.
  • [16:18:03] <jkridner|work> wmat: does that answer?
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  • [16:32:55] <Russ> oi, the new gedit search function is horrible
  • [16:33:03] <woglinde> gwhat?
  • [16:33:21] <av500> kate for gnome
  • [16:33:59] <Russ> if you hit enter, it doesn't active the search
  • [16:34:25] <Russ> it searches as you type, which makes for a very unpleasurable experience with 10MB text files
  • [16:34:49] * Ceriand|work has bad experiences with gedit causing mixed unix and windows line feeds when editing windows files
  • [16:35:18] <Ceriand|work> Russ: learn (g)vim, it'll make you a better person
  • [16:35:21] <Russ> that'll teach you to have files with windows line feeds lying around
  • [16:35:40] <Russ> Ceriand|work, selecting thousands of lines of text is easier with gedit
  • [16:35:57] <Russ> at least when the lines are somewhat arbitrary
  • [16:36:21] <wmat> jkridner|work: yes, thanks
  • [16:37:01] <Ceriand|work> ds2, jkridner|work: nice seeing you guys a maker faire, btw
  • [16:38:16] <woglinde> russ how do you select lines in gedit with mouse only?
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  • [16:38:56] <Russ> click text start, middle click on scrollbar, shift+click text end
  • [16:39:39] <bioster> Hi, I'm trying to get some LEDs working through the expansion ports on my beagle -xM
  • [16:39:56] <bioster> I'm following instructions on: http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2009/02/blinking-leds-with-the-beagle-board.html
  • [16:40:21] <bioster> but the LEDs I plug in, they glow faintly when I boot up and the commands to turn them on/off don't seem to do anything
  • [16:41:50] <jkridner|work> Ceriand|work: indeed, it was great meeting you face-to-face!
  • [16:42:25] <jkridner|work> bioster: are the LEDs allocated by the kernel you are using?
  • [16:43:01] <bioster> jkridner|work: Do you mean are the gpio directories being created?
  • [16:43:50] <jkridner|work> bioster: the latest interface is the LED class, layered on top of the GPIO class: http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/ABI/testing/sysfs-class-led
  • [16:44:24] <bioster> is that for the onboard LEDs?
  • [16:44:26] <Ceriand|work> they didn't really just stick an LED in the expansion header did they >_<
  • [16:44:39] <jkridner|work> the GPIO's directory cannot be created when they are reserved by the kernel for the LED driver.
  • [16:44:46] <av500> Ceriand|work: of course they did
  • [16:44:54] <Ceriand|work> *facepalm*
  • [16:45:00] <av500> arduino style
  • [16:45:11] <jkridner|work> Ceriand|work: oh, right, thanks for reminding me they are talking about the expansion board.
  • [16:45:17] * av500 (~av500@ip-95-223-110-54.unitymediagroup.de) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  • [16:45:18] * jkridner|work is asleep at the keyboard today.
  • [16:45:37] <jkridner|work> bioster: the LED interface is for the on-board LEDs.
  • [16:45:53] <bioster> Yeah, I'm trying to get an off-board LED working
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  • [16:46:27] <bioster> the on-board lights are kind of buried and hard to see, so I thought I'd run an LED somewhere more visible and use that to indicate status
  • [16:47:27] <bioster> Ceriand|work and av500: Is this a bad approach?
  • [16:48:02] <Ceriand|work> if you don't want to blow out the output drivers on the omap, it's a bad approach
  • [16:48:25] <Ceriand|work> they're only rated to source/sink a very small amount of current
  • [16:49:00] <bioster> What would you recommend then?
  • [16:49:35] <av500> a driver
  • [16:49:44] <Ceriand|work> or get a Trainer board
  • [16:51:14] <av500> or a FET
  • [16:51:46] <bioster> What's an FET?
  • [16:51:53] <Ceriand|work> a transistor
  • [16:52:06] <av500> a very small triode
  • [16:52:41] <bioster> ok, well I'd like to back up just a second...
  • [16:53:11] <bioster> Why did the LED not go on/off when I fiddled with the /sys/class/gpio stuff?
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  • [16:55:13] <Ceriand|work> bioster: that ball probably isn't muxed to be a gpio output
  • [16:55:35] <ds2> use a 2N2222 or a 2N3904 from ratshack
  • [16:55:48] <ds2> then hook it up to the LED class
  • [16:56:14] <ds2> and unless it is a read LED, you are not likely to even be able to light up the LED with the GPIO lines anyways
  • [16:56:44] <bioster> ds2: it did light up faintly on powerup, actually
  • [16:57:25] <ds2> bioster: are you sinking or sourcing from a GPIO?
  • [16:57:49] <ds2> in otherwords, how are you wiring it
  • [16:58:08] <bioster> well, I basically followed the directions in the link I mentioned earlier
  • [16:58:50] <bioster> put the short end into the ground on pin 28, the other into pin 24
  • [16:59:14] <bioster> then poked gpio 168 manually in /sys/class/gpio
  • [16:59:32] <ds2> "short end"? please say cathode or anode
  • [16:59:47] <ds2> I have seen LEDs come with either one short and some are preclipped
  • [17:00:10] <ds2> also, doing what you are doing is likely to wear out your board in short order...hope you have a backup on order.
  • [17:00:37] <bioster> ok, well when I run it on the bench power supply, it powers up with positive on the long end
  • [17:00:52] <bioster> the LED that is
  • [17:01:44] <ds2> what color?
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  • [17:02:09] <bioster> orange-ish
  • [17:02:23] <bioster> it's apparently supposed to be a yellow LED
  • [17:02:27] <ds2> look up the Vf
  • [17:02:29] <av500> ds2: its a red led, but the overcurrent makes it a nice orange glow
  • [17:02:36] <ds2> it is likely to be greater then 1.8V
  • [17:02:43] <bioster> yeah, it's 2.1v
  • [17:02:58] <av500> undercurrent then :)
  • [17:03:08] <ds2> av500: nah... the totem pole driver fuse will trigger before that happens ;)
  • [17:03:17] <ds2> well... then
  • [17:03:30] * brijesh (~brijesh@nat/ti/x-pakiimkqywbqcaoc) Quit ()
  • [17:03:34] <ds2> drop in a 2N3904 or 2N2222 or whatever you favorite transistor is
  • [17:03:58] <bioster> now, you said to 'hook it up to the LED class', that sounds like a good idea
  • [17:04:03] <ds2> source it off a suitable supply, account for Vsat and Vf when selecting the supply
  • [17:04:06] <bioster> how would I do that? (do you have a link?)
  • [17:04:18] <ds2> RTFDD
  • [17:04:21] <ds2> :D
  • [17:04:55] <bioster> heh, ok :D
  • [17:04:58] <ds2> and do make sure the transistor has sufficient Ibase to put it into saturation
  • [17:05:37] * bioster isn't a hardware guy, so this is all new to him.
  • [17:05:40] <ds2> or use something with a low enough grid voltage threshold
  • [17:05:49] <ds2> oops, s/grid/gate/ ;)
  • [17:06:56] <Russ> and don't forget to tighten the compensation crank
  • [17:07:26] <bioster> Can I route it through the main deflector dish first?
  • [17:07:41] <Ceriand|work> bioster: the easiest way would probably be to get a n-channel FET, hook the LED anode to V+, hook a resistor from the cathode of the LED to the drain of the FET, the source of the FET to ground, and the base of the FET to your GPIO pin
  • [17:08:55] <av500> linux/drivers/misc/fet ?
  • [17:09:05] <Ceriand|work> if you're going to be switching it fast, I'd also put a series resistor on the base as well
  • [17:09:06] <bioster> Ceriand|work: I think I understood that... :D
  • [17:10:39] <Ceriand|work> you'll have to get a FET that has a Vth of <1.8V
  • [17:14:32] <tasslehoff> does the linux-omap mailing list have a digest option? haven't found it, so I always end up unsubscribing
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  • [17:22:56] <Ceriand|work> tasslehoff: don't believe so
  • [17:23:51] <av500> tasslehoff: setup a mail filter
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  • [17:28:27] <ds2> I would like to see a fet with a base!
  • [17:28:45] <ds2> got a P/N?
  • [17:29:21] <Russ> I missed that because of the split
  • [17:29:36] <ds2> <Ceriand|work> if you're going to be switching it fast, I'd also put a series
  • [17:29:36] <ds2> +resistor on the base as well
  • [17:29:46] <Russ> but if it didn't have a base, it'd fall right off the die
  • [17:30:44] <ds2> wonder how well would a paper on using triodes as LED drivers for a softer, more pleasing, visual look would go
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  • [17:59:06] <bioster> Thanks for the help, guys. I'll probably have a chance to try the LED out tomorrow. Take care!
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  • [19:38:47] <xxiao> ARM does not have any hotplug_pci support?#$?
  • [19:39:11] <xxiao> maybe 90% ARM does not have PCI interface is the cause
  • [19:40:08] <mru> there are arm-based chips with pci
  • [19:40:18] <mru> don't know if any of them support hotplug
  • [19:40:29] <mru> hotplug pci is more of a server thing
  • [19:40:35] <xxiao> last time i heard ARM is to do server space
  • [19:41:00] <mru> it's become fashionable to float such speculation
  • [19:41:11] <xxiao> now among nearly all the archs under kernel, arm stands out by not sourcing hotplug/Kconfig
  • [19:41:28] <mru> maybe because no arm system needs it
  • [19:41:30] <mru> (yet)
  • [19:41:44] <xxiao> i need it, darn
  • [19:41:51] <mru> pci hotplug?
  • [19:42:01] <mru> do you even have a pci bus?
  • [19:42:01] <xxiao> yes
  • [19:42:37] <xxiao> i have ti8168, yes it has pcie
  • [19:42:45] <mru> so it does
  • [19:42:51] <mru> but hotplug?
  • [19:43:09] <xxiao> after kernel is up, i load pci-fpag-devices, then need rescan the bus and assign BARs
  • [19:43:36] <xxiao> was trying to use hotplug framework, to fake-trigger a hotplug event for the task
  • [19:43:54] * zoolu (c05b42ba@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.91.66.186) Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  • [19:44:01] <xxiao> otherwise i had to (ugly) hack pci-scan manually with fixed resource pre-assigned, you don't want to do that
  • [19:44:16] <Ceriand|work> xxiao: you might want to send an e-mail the arm mailing list
  • [19:44:21] <mru> well, try adding the hotplug stuff then
  • [19:44:24] <mru> shouldn't be too hard
  • [19:45:11] <xxiao> mru: my boss does not give that window in his little fancy window project managerment thing
  • [19:45:30] <xxiao> i mean M$ project software
  • [19:45:37] <mru> get a new job
  • [19:45:50] <xxiao> it's all the same from my experience
  • [19:46:07] <mru> you're probably right
  • [19:46:21] <xxiao> i chose job based on the daily commute time, gas is pricey
  • [19:46:43] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: will do
  • [19:46:47] <mru> in the US? no way
  • [19:47:03] <woglinde> buy a electro car
  • [19:47:08] <woglinde> like tesla
  • [19:47:13] <koen> mru: shall we start a new rond of 64bit arm rumours
  • [19:47:15] <koen> ?
  • [19:48:28] <mru> heh
  • [19:49:28] <xxiao> i wish they add pci to more arm chips before 64bit
  • [19:49:36] <xxiao> s/wish/hope
  • [19:49:58] <mru> extending an instruction set to 64-bit is a huge amount of work
  • [19:50:03] <xxiao> so it can be used in server/storage/desktop scenarios
  • [19:50:14] <mru> slapping a pci controller on a soc is simple
  • [19:50:47] <mru> that said, I'm not sure it makes all that much sense
  • [19:51:06] <mru> onchip sata and GbE will get you quite far
  • [19:51:22] <woglinde> xxiao tegra has pcie lanes too
  • [19:51:26] <xxiao> 4430, 3530, 3730, imx5**, none of them have pci*
  • [19:51:36] <mru> those are phone chips
  • [19:51:40] <xxiao> tegra2/ti8168 do have it
  • [19:51:43] <mru> phones don't have pci slots
  • [19:51:48] <xxiao> i guess marvell might have it
  • [19:51:52] <mru> they do
  • [19:52:15] <Ceriand|work> with lightpeak/thunderport we'll see when we get pci-e on phone chips
  • [19:53:06] <koen> I'm reserving judgement till I get my hands on an actual thunderbolt device
  • [19:54:10] <xxiao> mru: phones may not need pci*, but arm is entering into other areas where pci/sata are key, i wish imx535 has pcie...
  • [19:54:20] <woglinde> hm maybee trimslice has pcie lanes exported
  • [19:54:22] <Ceriand|work> a phone sized computer that you could dock to a big monitor and keyboard would be cool
  • [19:54:22] <xxiao> ti8168 is great if it's priced at $15 a piece
  • [19:54:47] <woglinde> cerian you mean the motorola thinggie?
  • [19:54:52] <mru> xxiao: yes, "is entering"
  • [19:54:52] <Ceriand|work> in general
  • [19:55:11] <mru> as it gets further in, chips with more pc/server-like i/o will appear
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  • [19:55:27] <Ceriand|work> arm-based microblades would be cool too
  • [19:55:35] * xxiao needs to ask my bosss for hotplug window
  • [19:55:53] <mru> Ceriand|work: like that overo cluster they built at sandia
  • [19:56:16] <Ceriand|work> mru: didn't know about that, link?
  • [19:56:38] <mru> good question, I saw it IRL at ELC
  • [19:56:43] <Ceriand|work> ah
  • [19:57:01] <mru> 49 overos in a smallish case
  • [19:57:51] <xxiao> that must be very hot
  • [19:58:32] <koen> it was quite cool actually
  • [19:58:38] <koen> the fans were for the 100W PSU
  • [19:59:10] <woglinde> *g*
  • [19:59:16] <mru> it shouldn't run any warmer than a small pc
  • [19:59:49] <mru> and being spread out, airflow is less of a problem
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  • [20:02:09] <xxiao> mru: which chip is on that particular overa, 3503, 3530, 3730?
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  • [20:02:54] <koen> 3530
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  • [20:02:59] <koen> gumstix overo
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  • [20:03:55] <xxiao> arm-cluster, very interesting...
  • [20:04:12] <koen> and they rum 10 VMs on each overo
  • [20:04:23] <koen> so 490 nodes per box
  • [20:04:29] <xxiao> in fact one friend of mine is joining an arm startup to develop arm chips for storage space this week i think
  • [20:04:58] <xxiao> 10 VMs on each overo?
  • [20:05:06] <koen> yes
  • [20:05:16] <xxiao> define VM
  • [20:05:24] <koen> virtual machine
  • [20:05:32] <xxiao> i know that, i mean what VM is it
  • [20:05:35] <koen> the want to simulate a botnet with them
  • [20:05:49] <xxiao> little kvm, qemu or what
  • [20:06:02] <xxiao> or hypervisor, not sure if it's available on arm yet
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  • [20:07:53] <mranostay> mru: i think i recall seeing that at ELC
  • [20:08:19] <xxiao> mru: google found nothing on that overo cluster, trying
  • [20:08:58] <xxiao> but i'm surprised 3530 can even start 10 VMs
  • [20:09:14] <mru> I guess they were not running ubuntu
  • [20:09:30] <xxiao> mru: i c, must be using koen's angstrom!
  • [20:10:39] <xxiao> actually they can run many tinyos on top of hypervisor
  • [20:13:56] * xxiao is watching the overo cluster video at gumstix.com
  • [20:15:52] <xxiao> they actually used 200 overos, each one has 10 VMs, that's 2000, impressive
  • [20:16:04] <xxiao> good lightening for Christmas too
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  • [20:33:12] <_av500_> why waste so much money on simulating a botnet when renting one is so cheap...
  • [20:33:55] <mranostay> heh
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  • [20:41:27] <woglinde> good nite
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  • [20:47:39] <koen> http://pastebin.com/JADncdCV
  • [20:47:42] <koen> argh
  • [20:47:52] <koen> Subject: [PATCH] free rev gpios when they are read, so others can read them la
  • [20:48:00] <koen> is that patch what I think it is?
  • [20:49:54] <ds2> uh....
  • [20:50:04] <ds2> STOP F'ING WITH THE GPIOS IN USERSPACE!@$#@#!%#@$#
  • [20:50:26] <ds2> what's next? a patch to allow non root users to toggle GPIOs?
  • [20:52:27] <ynezz> chmod 777 /dev/mem
  • [20:53:26] <thurbad> lol, people are trying to access the gpio's used to test the beagle rev?
  • [20:53:51] <thurbad> aren't they hardwired anyway?
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  • [20:54:27] <thurbad> or do they want to read the beagle rev from user space?
  • [20:54:37] <ynezz> the latter
  • [20:54:39] <thurbad> that would actually make some sense
  • [20:54:50] <ynezz> but isn't there some sys/proc info?
  • [20:55:18] <thurbad> dunno
  • [20:55:34] <mranostay> koen: that is classic :)
  • [20:55:52] <thurbad> I haven't seen any set in the beagle configuration
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  • [20:58:28] <ynezz> ds2: whats wrong with gpio access in the userspace?
  • [20:58:30] <ds2> export that that info properly... say in /proc/cpuinfo or another sysfs entry
  • [20:58:43] <ds2> ynezz: doing the wrong thing can fry stuff
  • [20:59:00] <ds2> depending on how it is wired, you might be able to use that to do privillege escalation
  • [20:59:08] <ds2> it is a BAD idea
  • [20:59:40] <ynezz> well, it's development board, not CE
  • [20:59:56] * jkridner|work (~a0321898@nat/ti/x-llqjabwkjbvomsyk) has joined #beagle
  • [21:00:30] <ynezz> and I quite like to just use sysfs to set/read gpio from the scripts and I don't see anything wrong about that
  • [21:00:57] <jacekowski> any direct interface to hardware from userland is bad idea
  • [21:01:07] <ynezz> ah so
  • [21:01:22] <jacekowski> that's why modern software is lot more portable than dos software
  • [21:01:32] <jacekowski> that had all drivers included inside
  • [21:01:36] <jacekowski> and shit happened
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  • [21:02:10] <ynezz> shit can happen in u-boot or mlo also
  • [21:02:22] * jpsaman (~jpsaman@videolan/developer/jpsaman) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
  • [21:02:24] <jacekowski> that's bootloader
  • [21:02:25] <ynezz> whatever
  • [21:02:29] <ds2> if you need to set/read gpios, prehaps do it in a bare metal setup, say the bootloader
  • [21:02:39] <jacekowski> only kernel/bootloader should be device specific
  • [21:02:46] <ds2> u-boot has the ability to run diag programs directly w/o Linux
  • [21:03:23] <ynezz> man, how would you easily switch on led, read button from the userspace
  • [21:03:29] <ynezz> write module?
  • [21:03:39] <ynezz> which would be controlled via sysfs?
  • [21:03:47] <ds2> there is drivers to do both of those
  • [21:03:55] <ds2> and examples in the kernel to do that.
  • [21:04:09] <ynezz> so this is how he did read the beagle revision
  • [21:04:17] <ds2> if you are writing a device specific model, prehaps you need to have a chat with the folks on LKML ;)
  • [21:04:21] * BThompson (~a0193480@nat/ti/x-qnxglsfaunazyuvb) has joined #beagle
  • [21:04:24] <ynezz> read it via sysfs
  • [21:04:37] <ynezz> and now it stopped working
  • [21:05:10] <ynezz> because it's not freed, it's still allocated by gpio lib, do you see my point now?
  • [21:05:13] <jacekowski> ynezz: sysfs isn't way to do it
  • [21:05:16] <jacekowski> ynezz: /dev is way to do it
  • [21:05:31] <ds2> put that info in cpuinfo
  • [21:05:53] <ynezz> what if there's another driver in the kernel
  • [21:06:03] <ynezz> needing the same info about the revision?
  • [21:06:08] <ds2> others boards do that already
  • [21:06:14] <jacekowski> ynezz: layers
  • [21:06:15] <ds2> there are macros to handle that
  • [21:06:19] <ynezz> but it won't work
  • [21:06:39] <ds2> that's how you act differently on different boards/revs/cpus/etc
  • [21:07:13] <ynezz> do you actually know something about that gpio framework in the kernel?
  • [21:07:33] <ds2> do you know something about the kernel?
  • [21:07:50] <ynezz> if you allocate that gpio and forget to free it, than nobody can request that gpio pin again
  • [21:08:01] <jacekowski> yes
  • [21:08:06] <ynezz> so his patch might be actaully fine
  • [21:08:11] <jacekowski> and that's how it's supposed to be
  • [21:08:24] <jacekowski> i don't want anybody touching my I/Os when i'm touching them
  • [21:09:02] <jacekowski> imagine auto releasing locks everywhere
  • [21:09:05] <ds2> prehaps you should look again
  • [21:09:13] <ds2> the kernel keeps track of what GPIO is setup for what
  • [21:09:21] <ds2> freeing it is a bad idea
  • [21:09:49] <jacekowski> koen: do you have link to that post
  • [21:10:52] <jacekowski> 22:50 < ds2> what's next? a patch to allow non root users to toggle GPIOs?
  • [21:11:03] <ds2> eh?
  • [21:11:05] <jacekowski> ds2: do you know that's how most drivers in android are implemented
  • [21:11:11] * brijesh (~brijesh@nat/ti/x-jhingjgbyweicoda) Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
  • [21:11:24] <jacekowski> just letting usermode access memory
  • [21:11:26] <ds2> jacekowski: most of the stuff in android is broken
  • [21:11:38] <jacekowski> most?
  • [21:11:40] <jacekowski> all of i
  • [21:11:42] * GPSFan (~kenm@64.92.145.112) has joined #beagle
  • [21:11:42] <jacekowski> it*
  • [21:11:54] <ds2> well, init does run w/o a segfault most of the time :D
  • [21:12:26] <jacekowski> they've probably copied it from somewhere
  • [21:13:18] <xxiao> tricky question, is pci hotpluggable?
  • [21:13:31] <jacekowski> yes
  • [21:13:36] <ds2> this war of escalation really needs to stop and it needs to begin with the developers
  • [21:13:50] <xxiao> jacekowski: WHY
  • [21:13:53] <_av500_> war?
  • [21:13:54] <xxiao> why
  • [21:13:54] <jacekowski> some implementations are
  • [21:14:00] <ynezz> ok, there's omap3_beagle_get_rev() which returns that rev from gpio, but it's static, unusable
  • [21:14:16] <jacekowski> xxiao: all non-stop systems are
  • [21:14:20] <xxiao> usb is hotpluggable by design, plug and play
  • [21:14:22] <jacekowski> xxiao: even cpus are hotpluggable
  • [21:14:47] <ds2> _av500_: yes... put in sudo..then put in SELinux...then disable that and put in other patches...STOP that nonsense
  • [21:14:47] <xxiao> pci, instead, is coldpluggable, only compactPCI is hotpluggable(physically it's hot-swappable)
  • [21:14:55] <ynezz> so the only way of getting the beagle revision now is via mmap'ing of /dev/mem :)
  • [21:15:00] <ds2> xxiao: CardBus is PCI
  • [21:15:22] <_av500_> ds2: sorry, cannot follow
  • [21:15:23] <xxiao> CardBus relatives are hotpluggable
  • [21:15:28] <ds2> and if you claim cardbus isn't hotpluggable... ;)
  • [21:15:53] <ds2> _av500_: we started with root and passwords. people didn't like that, so they worked around that with sudo
  • [21:16:05] <ds2> since sudo gives people root, that's too dangerous, so they added SELinux
  • [21:16:07] <jacekowski> xxiao: read about hp integrity
  • [21:16:07] <ds2> and on it goes
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  • [21:17:21] <jacekowski> well, selinux is good thing
  • [21:17:22] <xxiao> my confusion was on hotplug and hot-swap
  • [21:18:00] <_av500_> swapping cold data makes more sense
  • [21:19:59] <xxiao> pcmcia sits in parallel with pci under drivers, and pcmcia uses the same pci calls
  • [21:21:23] * AxMountain (~AxMountai@spaceman.csbnet.se) Quit (Quit: Leaving.)
  • [21:22:10] <Ceriand|work> pcmcia is like 16-bit ISA, PC-Card is pci IIRC
  • [21:22:40] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: that's right, reading some stuff on it. while pccard is more of pci, it's under usb's guidance now
  • [21:23:55] <ds2> no
  • [21:24:05] <ds2> pcmcia is ISA; CardBus is PCI
  • [21:24:40] <Ceriand|work> yea, that sounds right
  • [21:25:34] <_av500_> pcmcia is dead
  • [21:26:10] <xxiao> could not find cardbus site
  • [21:26:20] <xxiao> is it fully under usb.org? checking
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  • [21:26:53] <Ceriand|work> _av500_: except for compactflash
  • [21:27:05] <djlewis> my 1998 toshiba laptop has a very much alive pcmcia :)
  • [21:27:08] <djlewis> my wifi card
  • [21:27:10] <ds2> CF is a subset of PCMCIA
  • [21:27:35] <ds2> nice thing is PCMCIA can be mostly implemented with the GPMC stuff ;)
  • [21:27:53] <xxiao> CF is the new PCMCIA
  • [21:28:15] <xxiao> ExpressCard is the new CardBus, which is in usb.org now
  • [21:28:22] <xxiao> s/CF/Cardbus
  • [21:28:45] <_av500_> nah, just use CF in IDE mode
  • [21:28:52] <_av500_> ftw
  • [21:29:55] <xxiao> i want to use a small module to trigger a fake hotplug event to force a pci-rescan leveraging hotplug framework
  • [21:30:26] <xxiao> trying to find out how that hotplug event is sent by newly added hardware
  • [21:31:13] <Ceriand|work> xxiao: if you just want to reinitialize some device, you could just unbind and rebind it from sysfs
  • [21:31:25] <xxiao> say, usb-core, pcmcia-core, pci-core base code must be able to detect a hotplug device is inserted before its driver is loaded
  • [21:32:23] <xxiao> since the new device's kernel module might not have loaded yet, interrupt line won't help here to notify kernel
  • [21:33:21] <xxiao> must be something else, for both usb/pcmcia/pci hotplug event report(not report to udev, one layer down to hardware surface)
  • [21:34:25] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: i don't know, the point is that i have to bind it first,then unbind and rebind.
  • [21:35:26] <xxiao> basically, i load a pci-fpga image, manually generate a hotplug hardware event via software,force a hotplug rescan on the pci bus
  • [21:35:32] <_av500_> One Driver to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
  • [21:35:44] <xxiao> but i don't know how to fakely generate the hotplug event to kernel
  • [21:35:46] <xxiao> yet
  • [21:39:51] <Ceriand|work> xxiao: couldn't you just poke /sys/bus/pci/rescan after you're done loading your bitstream into the FPGA?
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  • [21:42:26] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: not really
  • [21:43:03] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: rescan means you probed that device already,
  • [21:43:18] <ds2> use a static FPGA? ;)
  • [21:43:35] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: my problem is that after the bitstream, the bus is not probed, and i need force a rescan
  • [21:44:11] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: i can add pci_rescan_bus calls to my driver, however that's a hack, as i need manually assign resources
  • [21:44:23] <xxiao> i mean _fixed_ resources, too ugly
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  • [21:45:11] <xxiao> ds2: don't know how much more statis costs
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  • [21:45:31] <bobkatzz> koen: ping
  • [21:45:39] <bobkatzz> jkridner: pong
  • [21:45:40] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: i could also load fpga under uboot, but it delays booting time, which is not customer friendly
  • [21:45:50] <bobkatzz> Crofton|road: paddle
  • [21:45:56] <ds2> hey mr bricklayer
  • [21:46:12] <bobkatzz> hey ds2
  • [21:46:13] <_av500_> bobkatzz: gm
  • [21:46:25] <bobkatzz> howdy _av500_
  • [21:46:43] <xxiao> in fact, too many options, none fits, sigh
  • [21:46:45] <Ceriand|work> xxiao: yea, that's tough. we just use flash FPGAs here to avoid all that
  • [21:46:52] <bobkatzz> jeez I was in here a couple days ago and it was like zombie land without the zombies hehe
  • [21:48:09] <bobkatzz> anyone tried using smartphone for touch inteface to the BB?
  • [21:48:44] <bobkatzz> thought it might be a neat project
  • [21:49:01] <bobkatzz> but of course I'm not an EE
  • [21:49:35] <_av500_> bobkatzz: you was there for like 5 minutes
  • [21:50:23] <_av500_> bobkatzz: you could emulate a mouse or a touchpad this way
  • [21:50:49] <Ceriand|work> bobkatzz: I've used this on the BB http://goo.gl/FdXDW
  • [21:52:12] <ds2> bobkatzz: but why? adding a touch interface to the BB is next to trivial
  • [21:53:21] <xxiao> Ceriand|work: other than actel, is altera/xilinx selling static/flash fpga?
  • [21:53:35] <Ceriand|work> xxiao: dunno, we use actel
  • [21:54:07] <xxiao> our initial image size if close 7MB, does that sound normal for actel's flash fpga?
  • [21:55:16] <ds2> actel does have some big parts
  • [21:57:00] <xxiao> will ask our fpga guy to look into that...
  • [21:57:30] <xxiao> it also have something to do with existing fpga IP blocks that we can integrate
  • [21:57:34] <xxiao> s/have/has
  • [21:59:40] <ds2> heh... like using a licensed IP for the PCI interface? ;)
  • [21:59:54] <xxiao> pcie yes
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  • [22:16:21] <bobkatzz> hi - sorry - wifey reminded it was Gin&Tonic time B^) ok - I'm back - so ds2 trvial?
  • [22:16:21] * panto (~panto@vfppp062038104093.dsl.hol.gr) Quit (Quit: Leaving)
  • [22:16:50] <ds2> bobkatzz: maybe I should ask - what are you trying to accomplish =)
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  • [22:19:31] <bobkatzz> well we all have i/smart Phones anyway so why add yet another device to the mix let's do a mashup of stuff we already have.
  • [22:20:15] <bobkatzz> so BB to iPhone is not a crazy idea - - yes you have two OS but they are almost mutually exclusive in Apple's case
  • [22:20:38] <bobkatzz> so I can us my iPhone as the ouchscreen for the BeagleBrick and do ham radio on it -
  • [22:21:25] <bobkatzz> or spend $$ setting up a business to do a ham radio app for the iPnone which would then need all the dependaensices on ther eas weel - which are already done on the BB
  • [22:22:09] <bobkatzz> hehe "ouchscreen" that was a freudian finger moment heh
  • [22:23:07] <ds2> for that, why not just use VNC?
  • [22:23:21] <ds2> vs a completely generic touch screen interface
  • [22:23:36] <bobkatzz> that's agood question
  • [22:23:52] <bobkatzz> speed would be one i guess
  • [22:24:04] <bobkatzz> DSP takes some bandwidth
  • [22:24:06] <_av500_> and ease of use
  • [22:24:31] <_av500_> you want the ui native on the e.g. iphone
  • [22:24:41] <bobkatzz> I've seen what it takes to release an app on iPhone - it's rough
  • [22:24:54] <ds2> the UI on the iPhone blows chunks
  • [22:24:58] <_av500_> make and android app then :)
  • [22:25:00] <ds2> almost as much as the android UI
  • [22:25:09] <ds2> now the Maemo UI... ;)
  • [22:25:37] <ds2> those pos's are too thin to be used as a brick but that's all they are really good for
  • [22:26:16] <bobkatzz> yeah i've looked at Mimo those are really nice - don't know if anyone has used them as USB monitor for BB - ??
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  • [22:26:47] <Ceriand|work> There's a VNC app for Maemo
  • [22:26:52] <bobkatzz> but then again - USB may not be fast enough
  • [22:27:22] <bobkatzz> are you sayinf maemo or the Mimo touchscreens
  • [22:27:33] <bobkatzz> or as I said earlier - "ouchscreens"
  • [22:28:00] <bobkatzz> < - - - is looking up Maemo
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  • [22:29:00] <bobkatzz> hmmm meego
  • [22:32:29] * florian (~fuchs@Maemo/community/contributor/florian) Quit (Quit: Verlassend)
  • [22:32:33] <bobkatzz> in fact if you use bluetooth on the Xm (or is it xM>) you wouldn't even need any cables right?
  • [22:32:57] <bobkatzz> i;m trying to make the BB transparent
  • [22:33:44] <bobkatzz> so you "talk" to it with whatever other device you have - hell, it's on the internet, call it up with your landline - I don't care :)
  • [22:36:59] <ds2> sure, BT would work
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  • [22:45:45] <bobkatzz> so ds2 what have you been up to? _av500_ ?
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  • [22:47:48] <bobkatzz> I racked up 10, 1000 mile per watt awards with my PSK20 on PSK31 on 20 meters, half of them with the BB and FLDigi
  • [22:48:26] <bobkatzz> which is actually the same components as the BeagleBrick minus the kewl conatiner - or in "guts on the table mode" as I call it hehe
  • [22:49:51] <bobkatzz> I think the record was 2,663 mile per watt to Ukraine
  • [22:51:57] * mranostay (~mranostay@108-64-218-123.lightspeed.moblal.sbcglobal.net) has joined #beagle
  • [22:52:03] <bobkatzz> now I'm working on trying to get an xM model to get everything to the next stage - no need for half of the interstitial board specs since I'll be working with a Flex 1500 as the rig
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  • [22:59:52] <bobkatzz> din din morris B^)
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  • [23:01:26] <ds2> bobkatzz: helped out at Maker Faire this past weekend
  • [23:01:32] <ds2> doh
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