• [00:00:03] <ds2> use a microdrive
  • [00:01:19] <mru> denix: the commercial version has been released
  • [00:01:23] <mru> would you like a copy?
  • [00:01:26] <mru> it's gpl...
  • [00:02:08] <ds2> mru: how did you get it?
  • [00:02:23] <mru> registered for an eval download
  • [00:02:56] <ds2> heh nice
  • [00:03:05] <maelcum> weirdness
  • [00:03:35] <maelcum> the distribution model
  • [00:03:47] <mru> very weird
  • [00:04:18] <geckosenator> can microdrives go where sdcards are?
  • [00:04:20] <geckosenator> or are they usb?
  • [00:04:25] <denix> mru: we should have it here already, thanks
  • [00:04:33] <mru> geckosenator: aren't they CF?
  • [00:04:34] <denix> geckosenator: MDs are CF
  • [00:04:35] <ds2> USB or direct CF
  • [00:04:45] <maelcum> microdrives are way too thick, and generally big, afaik
  • [00:05:01] <mru> CF type 2
  • [00:05:04] <ds2> they sell microdrives with a tiny USB case
  • [00:05:38] <geckosenator> well they are high power consumption
  • [00:05:46] <denix> mru: I was just wondering how 2009q1 performs against prev releases...
  • [00:06:00] <mru> probably not much difference
  • [00:06:07] <mru> it's still gcc 4.3
  • [00:06:10] <ds2> they inhale batteries like they are going out of style
  • [00:06:13] <maelcum> i don't think that microdrives still make much sense
  • [00:06:16] <mru> which is equal or worse than 4.2
  • [00:06:43] <ds2> for small formfactor, they are your only real choice unless you can tolerate a 1.8
  • [00:06:45] <denix> are you saying there is no hope for 4.3? :)
  • [00:06:47] <ds2> drive
  • [00:06:53] <mru> there is no hope for gcc
  • [00:07:01] <mru> it's broken beyond repair
  • [00:07:13] <mru> imo it should be scrapped
  • [00:07:19] <geckosenator> what do you mean?
  • [00:07:21] <maelcum> llvm looks pretty good
  • [00:07:28] <mru> I mean gcc is a hideous mess
  • [00:07:33] <geckosenator> mru: it's no good at generating code?
  • [00:07:33] <mru> nobody understands it
  • [00:07:33] <denix> ok, it's time to go hang or shoot myself... :)
  • [00:07:43] <geckosenator> mru: it's too big for one person to understand it all
  • [00:07:43] <mru> each new release has more bugs than the previous
  • [00:07:51] <geckosenator> mru: I understand rtl pretty well
  • [00:07:57] * davidm2 (n=David@nat/ti/x-0e56b4d419562248) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [00:08:06] <mru> it's not about understanding rtl
  • [00:08:09] <geckosenator> heh
  • [00:08:13] <geckosenator> I know
  • [00:08:14] <mru> go look at the gcc bug database
  • [00:08:19] <geckosenator> no thanks
  • [00:08:23] <geckosenator> I would rather add features :-P
  • [00:08:36] <mru> that's the problem
  • [00:08:43] <geckosenator> that's what everyone does
  • [00:08:50] <mru> they're adding features without first fixing what's there
  • [00:08:52] <ds2> so how many versions of dark-age GCC do you anticipate before the GCC revival?
  • [00:09:05] * maelcum is waiting for good c++ support in clang for llvm (and for the optimizer to catch up to gcc's)
  • [00:09:05] <geckosenator> anyway, I don't like the way the backend works
  • [00:09:15] <mru> more likely some other compiler will overtake it
  • [00:09:27] <mru> I don't give a damn about c++
  • [00:09:39] <geckosenator> I would rather describe the instruction set to the compiler
  • [00:09:44] <maelcum> btw, 4.4 is mostly disappointing as far as i'm concerned (not using much matrix math, thank you very much)
  • [00:09:47] <geckosenator> I don't care about c++ either
  • [00:09:48] <ds2> so we gcc users are doomed?!
  • [00:09:59] <geckosenator> ds2: I don't think so
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  • [00:10:55] <mru> gcc 4.4 for ppc fails about 100 of the ffmpeg tests
  • [00:11:25] <coreyfro> What is CSL? I my google foo is overwhelmed with results
  • [00:11:32] <mru> gcc svn doesn't even compile it
  • [00:11:38] <geckosenator> well that's ffmpeg...
  • [00:11:42] <ds2> mru: so the next step is to make libtool also compile code to work around gcc bugs? ;)
  • [00:11:43] <maelcum> geckosenator: a standard parameterized cpu and instruction set model requires a ridiculously detailed cpu simulation for good optimization, i fear.
  • [00:11:58] <geckosenator> maelcum: not if you use feedback
  • [00:12:03] <ds2> </sarcasm> if it wasn't obvious
  • [00:12:16] <geckosenator> maelcum: and you can run feedback simulations on one system then cache the results
  • [00:12:16] <mru> well, gcc doesn't optimise very well
  • [00:12:25] <geckosenator> exactly, because it's too dumb
  • [00:12:45] <geckosenator> I want to have it sit around for weeks on a super computer and figure out smart stuff and remember it
  • [00:12:49] <geckosenator> then everyone uses that
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  • [00:13:02] <geckosenator> I wrote a simple superoptimizer which did it, but the results are so far marginal
  • [00:13:09] <maelcum> feedback is a very interesting idea. it can get ugly when you're not compiling on the target cpu though.
  • [00:13:12] <geckosenator> only .5% code reduction/speed increase
  • [00:13:34] <geckosenator> then you have to use a simulator
  • [00:13:34] <maelcum> ideal for gentoo maybe ^^
  • [00:13:37] <geckosenator> heh
  • [00:13:51] <geckosenator> the feedback thing doesnt' run on most computers though
  • [00:14:00] <coreyfro> Are you guys familiar with "Acovea"? The genetic optimizer for gcc?
  • [00:14:09] <geckosenator> yes, and I thought it was crap
  • [00:14:16] <geckosenator> for one thing it's written in c++
  • [00:14:19] <mru> that just fiddles with flags
  • [00:14:21] <geckosenator> and another thing, it just changes flags
  • [00:14:29] <mru> or am I thinking of something else?
  • [00:14:29] <geckosenator> and it couldn't handle more than 1 file when I tried it
  • [00:14:29] <coreyfro> gotcha
  • [00:14:38] <coreyfro> You are correct
  • [00:14:41] <maelcum> c++ like llvm and clang, sorry guys :)
  • [00:15:27] <geckosenator> I think gcc needs some fairly drastic changes to the backend to emit much better code though
  • [00:16:46] <maelcum> afaik the gcc guys did not separate some parts well, specifically to make it harder to write some evil proprietary compiler extensions or some such.
  • [00:16:52] <denix> coreyfro: CodeSourcery Lite
  • [00:17:32] <mru> maelcum: it's sad when politics gets in the way of quality
  • [00:18:15] <maelcum> yea
  • [00:19:06] <maelcum> btw, what's the best competition and how good is it at optimization? afaik gcc isn't that bad, epecially on intel.
  • [00:19:06] <geckosenator> well I can't blame them
  • [00:19:21] <geckosenator> well it's not very good on anything imho
  • [00:19:43] <mru> it probably sucks the least on intel
  • [00:19:44] <geckosenator> at least in terms of what is possible
  • [00:20:07] <mru> every other serious compiler I've tried easily outperforms gcc
  • [00:20:14] <geckosenator> on intel?
  • [00:20:17] <geckosenator> or arm?
  • [00:20:24] <maelcum> gcc has quite good c++ support and even some nifty C "extensions" that actually make sense
  • [00:20:28] <mru> intel, arm, ppc, alpha, anything
  • [00:20:46] <maelcum> i think it's decent, just moving too slowly now.
  • [00:20:50] <mru> imo they should fix standard C before adding silly extensions
  • [00:20:59] * denix didn't mean to start a flamewar - time to silently disappear... :)
  • [00:21:02] <maelcum> ideally, of course yes
  • [00:21:17] <geckosenator> well I don't really care that much since it just compiles c code
  • [00:21:27] <geckosenator> it supposidly has other languages
  • [00:21:31] <ds2> BAH C++
  • [00:21:33] <geckosenator> but they aren't used too much
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  • [00:21:50] <geckosenator> I would rather see a very much more advanced lisp compiler of some kind
  • [00:21:54] <ds2> there has got to be a good saying about the road to hell and C++...
  • [00:22:20] <geckosenator> after I learned c++ the first time, I thought I knew it
  • [00:22:29] <geckosenator> but then I found out later I didn't really know it
  • [00:25:03] <maelcum> at kde we use Qt which is simpler and more self-contained than std::* and rather comprehensive. even stroustrup said that c++ is made for use with good class libraries (not "with std::*").
  • [00:25:48] <geckosenator> I use Qt
  • [00:26:03] <maelcum> nice :)
  • [00:26:05] <geckosenator> it's ok
  • [00:26:15] <geckosenator> but really it's built on top of c++ which is crap
  • [00:26:27] <geckosenator> although I found some qt scheme bindings I want to try out
  • [00:26:42] * denix is away: I'm not here
  • [00:27:04] <maelcum> i think that the general approach of c++ is sound (and there is no viable competition for what it does), but D does it better.
  • [00:27:10] <maelcum> only nobody uses D
  • [00:27:36] <geckosenator> uh
  • [00:27:47] <geckosenator> D adds variable length arguments to templates
  • [00:27:52] <geckosenator> which is just ridiculous
  • [00:28:05] <maelcum> no it's not afaics
  • [00:28:20] <maelcum> e.g. variant types with a list of types they can "be"
  • [00:28:24] <geckosenator> you can do anything templates can do with preprocessor macros
  • [00:28:38] <geckosenator> it's just the way the compiler complains when you mess up that is different
  • [00:28:42] <ds2> this is all attempts to replace proper programmer discipline
  • [00:28:46] <maelcum> sort of, but you lose a lot of static checking
  • [00:28:53] <maelcum> yous said it
  • [00:28:59] <ds2> once you throw that out the door, nothing will work
  • [00:29:00] <geckosenator> actually macros are more powerful
  • [00:29:15] <geckosenator> but if you think about it, macros in c are very limited compared to other languages
  • [00:29:21] <geckosenator> for example, macros can't define macros
  • [00:29:32] <geckosenator> unless you run the preprocessor iteratively (my build system does this)
  • [00:29:38] <geckosenator> but I"m not sure that's considered c anymore
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  • [00:30:42] <geckosenator> I think all the stuff added in c++ tends to make people write code which runs slower, and uses more memory
  • [00:30:47] <geckosenator> even though that wasn't the idea
  • [00:30:49] <maelcum> macros are more powerful in the sense that assembly is more powerful than C. you have more freedom in assembly. but it's hard to understand programs.
  • [00:31:02] <geckosenator> yeah
  • [00:31:08] <geckosenator> well templates are not very good
  • [00:31:18] <geckosenator> compared to say lambda
  • [00:31:29] <mru> people that complain about macros in C shouldn't be writing code
  • [00:31:30] <mru> or reading it
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  • [00:31:42] <geckosenator> it's funny how lambda can implement everything in c++ and more
  • [00:32:02] <geckosenator> and not in a confusing way
  • [00:32:19] <ds2> understanding is a matter of prospective
  • [00:32:26] <geckosenator> mru: what about macros that define macros because I run the preprocessor iteratively?
  • [00:32:30] <ds2> learn to understand things not ask people to write dumber code
  • [00:32:46] <maelcum> understanding is also a matter of mental workload if you go as far as you can
  • [00:33:15] <mru> people shouldn't be telling smarter people what (not) to do
  • [00:33:17] <geckosenator> c++ pushes the object oriented thing too far
  • [00:33:34] <geckosenator> and not the functional aspects.. at least in my opinion
  • [00:33:41] <geckosenator> I would rather use a different language for that reason
  • [00:34:27] <maelcum> as far as pure old-school oo is concerned c++ doesn't go -that- far...
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  • [00:43:13] <ds2> mru: mind if I ask, how old are you?
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  • [00:48:10] <mru> ds2: I'm 28
  • [00:48:41] <geckosenator> I'm 23.. ds2 how about you?
  • [00:49:38] <Downix> 32
  • [00:49:44] <midtown4> 18!
  • [00:50:03] <geckosenator> is that a factorial?
  • [00:50:37] <midtown4> yes
  • [00:50:46] <geckosenator> I'm 3.98!
  • [00:52:03] <midtown4> no i thought ide just jump in while everyone else was
  • [00:52:10] <midtown4> can you factorial a decimal?
  • [00:52:31] <geckosenator> yes
  • [00:52:38] <midtown4> ah
  • [00:52:40] <geckosenator> I wrote a function in c to do it
  • [00:53:01] <geckosenator> return pow(x/exp(1) * sqrt(x*sinh(1/x) + 1/(810*pow(x, 6))), x) * sqrt(2*M_PI/x);
  • [00:53:05] <geckosenator> first increment x
  • [00:53:18] <geckosenator> and that's just approximate but it's good to like 8 decimals
  • [00:54:11] <geckosenator> it's actually the gamma function (hence incrementing x)
  • [00:57:07] <ds2> gecksenator: I am ancient
  • [00:57:31] <geckosenator> well if I count reincarnation
  • [00:57:37] <geckosenator> I'm really thousands of years old
  • [00:57:58] <ds2> mru: I was just testing my theory that the old people wanted things one way and the others wanted things another way but it seems the ages do not support that theory
  • [00:58:20] <geckosenator> I don't think it has to do with age
  • [00:59:29] <ds2> if it was age, then we really are doomed
  • [00:59:55] <geckosenator> oh, we are doomed anyway
  • [01:00:09] <geckosenator> just look at what's happening to the planet
  • [01:00:30] <midtown4> everything living has to die, even the living planet
  • [01:00:34] * jsync (n=jess@144.190.201.250) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [01:01:03] <geckosenator> it's cool how you can see the planet is living
  • [01:10:28] * Russ (i=foobar@ip70-176-249-242.ph.ph.cox.net) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  • [01:11:35] <geckosenator> so, I compiled the firmware in the kernel
  • [01:11:39] <geckosenator> and yet it still can't find it
  • [01:11:52] <geckosenator> actually maybe it found the file but:
  • [01:11:53] <geckosenator> [24928.809783] usb 2-1.1: USB control request for firmware upload failed. Error number -110
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  • [01:40:51] <djlewis> Yo!
  • [01:44:14] <geckosenator> hi
  • [01:44:50] <djlewis> I back read the channel. I missed a good cxx debate.
  • [01:46:14] * odesus (n=Victrix@201.165.133.8) has joined #beagle
  • [01:47:46] <Downix> you know, some .NET coders are really dumb
  • [01:47:53] <Downix> they don't recognize mono
  • [01:49:32] <geckosenator> uh
  • [01:49:33] <djlewis> Hey, I just installed mono today on linux box. seems the code I want to work with was done in c#
  • [01:49:45] <geckosenator> great
  • [01:50:33] <geckosenator> ooh I got my beagle working better!
  • [01:50:40] <djlewis> cool.
  • [01:50:45] <geckosenator> if I press the user button now, it connects to my bluetooth keybaord
  • [01:50:57] <geckosenator> so I can get a keyboard on boot
  • [01:51:03] <djlewis> easier than unplugging etc.
  • [01:51:12] <geckosenator> unplugging?
  • [01:51:15] <geckosenator> there is no plug
  • [01:51:17] <geckosenator> the keybaord is wireless
  • [01:51:23] <djlewis> I might need that button for my WIFI
  • [01:51:30] <geckosenator> heh really?
  • [01:51:41] <geckosenator> the program is like 30 lines of c I wrote
  • [01:51:57] <geckosenator> you run it with 2 parameters.. one is the device to monitor which is /dev/input/event0
  • [01:52:02] <djlewis> I found with a console build it works but with angstrom GUI it does not unless it is up pi
  • [01:52:04] <geckosenator> the other parameter is a command to run
  • [01:52:22] <djlewis> up = unplugged, pi = plugged in
  • [01:52:36] <geckosenator> I don't distinguish
  • [01:52:46] <djlewis> yep, bout the same
  • [01:53:07] <geckosenator> I just run the hid command when the button is pressed or released
  • [01:53:17] <geckosenator> but maybe I should make it so it doesn't run the command more than once a second or so
  • [01:53:21] <geckosenator> so it ignores teh release
  • [01:53:43] <djlewis> I been wondering how well wireless mice and kypds are working on boot.
  • [01:53:50] <djlewis> keyboards that is.
  • [01:54:06] <geckosenator> well they would work normally just fine
  • [01:54:11] <geckosenator> if usb would work normally
  • [01:54:21] <geckosenator> but unfortunately I have to boot my beagle then plug usb in
  • [01:54:23] <djlewis> good point
  • [01:54:26] <geckosenator> or usb doesn't work at all
  • [01:54:39] <djlewis> I feel there is a timing issue though
  • [01:54:50] <geckosenator> well so far it's working for me
  • [01:54:56] <djlewis> Well for the wifi anyway.
  • [01:54:59] <geckosenator> oh
  • [01:55:00] <geckosenator> my wifi works
  • [01:55:05] <geckosenator> but only with certain kernels
  • [01:55:13] <geckosenator> actually, there is only one kernel I get it working with
  • [01:55:16] <geckosenator> and I didn't build it
  • [01:55:28] <djlewis> with gui boot, only with unplugging
  • [01:55:41] <djlewis> Oh dont let that tell you anyting ;)
  • [01:55:42] <geckosenator> I don't think I'll do gui boot
  • [01:56:11] <geckosenator> just boot straight to framebuffer
  • [01:56:28] <geckosenator> another issue is the fact that I cannot easily change monitors
  • [01:56:42] <geckosenator> I need some kind of button to cycle through different monitor settings
  • [01:56:50] <geckosenator> I guess I can always boot with one, then switch it
  • [01:57:22] <djlewis> I was studying console options yesterday. If I wand webcam window then fb works?
  • [01:58:05] <geckosenator> it's working for me..
  • [01:58:10] <geckosenator> but I'm just typing on the fb console
  • [01:58:16] <geckosenator> I can't see anything at the moment
  • [01:58:21] <geckosenator> I'm going to install emacspeak though
  • [01:58:27] <geckosenator> so I can get audio
  • [01:58:41] <djlewis> what program for webcam?
  • [01:58:48] <geckosenator> gstreamer I think
  • [01:58:50] <geckosenator> or mencoder
  • [01:58:56] <geckosenator> I don't have it working right now
  • [01:58:59] <djlewis> is what you are using?
  • [01:59:03] <djlewis> oh
  • [01:59:06] <geckosenator> since the kernel which has working webcam
  • [01:59:09] <geckosenator> does not have working wifi
  • [01:59:24] <djlewis> what are you designing for anyway? you are on similar track yet not to me.
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  • [01:59:47] <geckosenator> portable computer
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  • [02:00:07] <djlewis> oh. the lcd and case talk last week. It's coming back to me now.
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  • [02:00:24] <geckosenator> I'm the one who wants to use a ziplock bag for a case
  • [02:01:00] <mib_9kh5hm> Is it possible to upgrade the RAM on the beagle board?
  • [02:01:08] <geckosenator> revC has more ram
  • [02:01:22] <mib_9kh5hm> Is recC available for purchase?
  • [02:01:26] <geckosenator> yes
  • [02:01:36] <mib_9kh5hm> Is that also $150?
  • [02:01:40] <geckosenator> yes
  • [02:01:44] <geckosenator> I just use swap though
  • [02:01:44] <Russ> mib_9kh5hm: you can also you ramzswap (compcache)
  • [02:01:55] <geckosenator> what is that?
  • [02:02:42] <Russ> compcache?
  • [02:02:58] <geckosenator> yeah
  • [02:03:03] <geckosenator> what does it do?
  • [02:03:06] <Russ> virtual block device backed by compressed pages
  • [02:03:31] <geckosenator> interesting
  • [02:03:36] <geckosenator> it must use fast compression though
  • [02:03:48] <geckosenator> if it's slower than reading and writing to disk it woudl be pointless
  • [02:03:59] * elesueur_ (n=elesueur@vampire.ertos.nicta.com.au) Quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
  • [02:03:59] <Russ> lza
  • [02:04:04] <Russ> writing to disk is really really slow
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  • [02:04:15] <geckosenator> yeah
  • [02:04:22] <geckosenator> lza is good
  • [02:04:24] <Russ> http://code.google.com/p/compcache/
  • [02:04:30] <Russ> or was it lzo....
  • [02:04:50] <geckosenator> lzo is better
  • [02:04:57] <geckosenator> I implemented it once.. it's interesting
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  • [02:05:28] <Russ> http://code.google.com/p/compcache/wiki/CompressedLengthDistribution
  • [02:05:32] * maelcum (n=horst@78.52.132.99) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [02:05:53] <Russ> http://code.google.com/p/compcache/wiki/LTSPPerf
  • [02:06:14] * timchen1` is now known as nasloc__
  • [02:06:20] <geckosenator> well it soudns like you could screw it up
  • [02:06:26] <mib_9kh5hm> In terms of speed, how usable would you say revC is to use as a laptop?
  • [02:06:27] <geckosenator> if you devoted too much space to compressd swap
  • [02:06:37] <geckosenator> Russ: do you still use swap on disk with lower priority?
  • [02:06:48] <geckosenator> mib_9kh5hm: i think revB is already useable
  • [02:06:57] <Russ> its set up for that
  • [02:07:07] <Russ> it will also use it for any pages that don't compress well
  • [02:07:13] <mib_9kh5hm> How does it handle bloated apps, like openoffice?
  • [02:07:13] <geckosenator> oh
  • [02:07:18] <geckosenator> Russ: so it uses all of ram?
  • [02:07:28] <geckosenator> mib_9kh5hm: use antiword instead
  • [02:07:29] <geckosenator> heh
  • [02:07:31] <Russ> unfortunately no, it doesn't use all of ram
  • [02:07:42] <geckosenator> so you have to specify how much?
  • [02:07:45] <Russ> you have to give it a fixed size for the virtual block device
  • [02:07:49] <geckosenator> it seems like you might screw taht up
  • [02:08:03] <geckosenator> like, would 32 megs be good?
  • [02:08:15] <Russ> 1/4 the size of ram is usually good
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  • [02:09:15] <Russ> I really think it'd be a cool project to abstract out the requesting of slow pages
  • [02:09:16] <geckosenator> too bad I can't get usb ram
  • [02:09:29] <geckosenator> so you can use more media?
  • [02:09:31] <Russ> so that compcache would be a user, and disk swap would be a user
  • [02:09:46] <Russ> that way you wouldn't need to have a virtual disk of fixed size
  • [02:09:48] <geckosenator> there are filesystems that also do compression
  • [02:09:59] <geckosenator> can it do compression for swap space which is on disk?
  • [02:10:09] <Russ> not that I'm aware of
  • [02:10:10] <geckosenator> since that's faster too
  • [02:10:37] <geckosenator> and if you had a way to do dma with lzo without cpu overhead..
  • [02:10:57] <Russ> also makes me want to make something that tracks COW pages and is capable of storing deltas
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  • [02:11:25] <geckosenator> oh interesting
  • [02:11:38] <geckosenator> just store the diffs and don't copy until it gets too big?
  • [02:11:44] <Russ> I suppose it'd greatly depend on workload
  • [02:11:51] <geckosenator> or make it split in a tree structure and only copy part of the page
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  • [02:11:58] <geckosenator> it sounds really tricky
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  • [02:12:03] <geckosenator> impossible to do correctly
  • [02:12:03] <Russ> right, but it'd be only for if the page gets "swapped out"
  • [02:12:06] <geckosenator> for all cases
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  • [02:12:30] <Russ> so COW would happen normally, but if you were going to swap a page that was COW, you could just store a delta
  • [02:12:37] <geckosenator> have you used compcache on the beagle?
  • [02:12:41] <Russ> er, swap a page that was COW'd
  • [02:12:43] <Russ> geckosenator: yes
  • [02:13:01] <geckosenator> my beagle is taking like an hour to byte-compile emacspeak
  • [02:13:20] <Russ> are you swapping to disk?
  • [02:13:26] <geckosenator> I don't have swap
  • [02:13:28] <geckosenator> at the moment
  • [02:14:02] <Russ> where is your bottleneck?
  • [02:14:04] <geckosenator> but I ahve 10 megs free :-P
  • [02:14:30] <geckosenator> looks like disk
  • [02:14:37] <geckosenator> is killing me
  • [02:14:45] <geckosenator> then the rest is the emacs byte compiler
  • [02:15:13] <mib_9kh5hm> Are there any benchmarks between this processor and the intel atom? (or any subjective thoughts?)
  • [02:15:46] <Russ> atom will give you better performance out of the box no questions
  • [02:15:47] <mib_9kh5hm> (in terms of raw performance, not power usage)
  • [02:16:02] <Russ> but you can get much better mips/watt from omap3
  • [02:16:16] <mib_9kh5hm> Any idea how much better performance the atom gives?
  • [02:16:37] <Russ> dunno, but if power utilization isn't a concern, who cares?
  • [02:16:46] <geckosenator> might as well use a quad core
  • [02:17:01] <mib_9kh5hm> It is a concern, but each issue can be looked in isolation I think :)
  • [02:17:31] <Russ> both atom and omap3 aim to provide a tradeoff between performance and power consumption
  • [02:17:44] <Russ> both weighing power and performance differently
  • [02:18:23] <Russ> atom prizes x86 architecture compatibility and also puts performance higher on the scale than OMAP3 does
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  • [02:18:34] <Russ> you lose a lot of power in the atom chipstep
  • [02:18:37] <Russ> er, chipset
  • [02:18:46] <Downix> atom sucks
  • [02:19:10] <Downix> I can build a desktop Athlon system that consumes less power
  • [02:19:11] <Russ> Downix: don't be so jaded, its a huge leap above what's available in a standard x86 architecture
  • [02:19:46] <mib_9kh5hm> Thanks Russ
  • [02:19:47] <Downix> Russ: it's a crippled core that is tied to an antique chipset. VIA and AMD both offer better alternatives
  • [02:20:15] <Russ> Downix: not from what I've seen
  • [02:20:20] <Downix> if nVidia is allowed to ship ION, then maybe it would be worth it
  • [02:20:34] <Downix> but as/is, it's not worth the trade offs
  • [02:20:47] <Downix> even if you stick to x86
  • [02:21:26] <Russ> I just can't stand people who rave about atom for embedded systems like its some new marvel and aren't aware of what's already available in the embedded spare (ARM, MIPS, etc)
  • [02:21:34] <Downix> With you there
  • [02:22:10] <Russ> afaik, its still tied to BIOS too
  • [02:22:26] <Downix> yup
  • [02:23:04] <Downix> Right now I am getting 8W of power consumption out of an AMD Athlon 64
  • [02:23:06] <djlewis> mib_9kh5hm: seems like you migh be ahead getting a $300.00 Eeeeeee notebook.
  • [02:23:24] <Russ> Downix: atom is 2.5W
  • [02:23:30] <Downix> pair that to an 780G chipset, you now are drawing less than the atom w/ chipset, have 64-bit compat, and crush it for performance
  • [02:23:39] <Downix> Russ: yes, but the atoms chipset is over 10W
  • [02:23:47] <Russ> yup
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  • [02:23:53] <Downix> Russ: 2.5W + 10W is more than 8W + 1W
  • [02:24:25] <Russ> course, when people compare things, they look at the consumption of a SoC versus the 2.5W consumption of atom
  • [02:24:36] <Downix> Well, to me that seems unfair
  • [02:24:42] <Russ> course
  • [02:25:14] <Russ> Downix: you really have a full AMD chipset that only uses 1W?
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  • [02:26:04] <Downix> Russ: the 780G is rated at 1W if you read the spec sheets for it
  • [02:26:07] <Russ> I really want to get my hands on tegra though, it sounds like fun
  • [02:26:17] <Russ> Downix: have you actually measured it?
  • [02:26:52] <Downix> Russ: the chipset itself, no, but the full system here using it is running off of a 45W PSU w/ HDD, DVD-RW and RAM
  • [02:27:18] <Russ> I don't think I'd trust the 1W number given numbers that I've seen from other chipsets
  • [02:27:29] <geckosenator> ooh I have emacspeak working on the beagle
  • [02:27:38] <Downix> Toms hardware did a head to head where they did pull up the power consumption
  • [02:27:45] <Downix> give me a few and I'll pull it up
  • [02:27:56] <Russ> geckosenator: work on full mythtv support for me next, ok?
  • [02:28:26] <Russ> Downix: is it vs the i945G?
  • [02:28:44] <Russ> or GSE?
  • [02:28:50] <geckosenator> heh ok
  • [02:29:22] <Russ> thats how I want to retire my beagleboards, bolt them onto the back of a TV
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  • [02:30:51] <Downix> i945GC
  • [02:30:57] <mib_9kh5hm> I'm off. Thanks for the help guys (esp. Russ)
  • [02:31:02] <Downix> ok, intel's nw is 22W vs 780G at 11w
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  • [02:31:11] <Downix> I was off my a factor of 10, my good
  • [02:31:12] <Downix> goof
  • [02:31:17] <geckosenator> i can use the beagle without a monitor now
  • [02:31:19] <Russ> thats the old stuff that got bolted to the atom when it first came out
  • [02:31:32] <Russ> the newer chipsets are under 10W
  • [02:31:51] <Downix> and that is using the 780G not the M780G for the AMD
  • [02:31:53] <geckosenator> and it has annoying static
  • [02:31:57] <Downix> so right now, who knows
  • [02:32:07] <Downix> still, I prefer MIPS or ARM
  • [02:34:16] <geckosenator> I just need to learn how to use emacspeak to check email, use irc, and play music files
  • [02:35:11] <Russ> geckosenator: you may have to spend time improving the alsa driver
  • [02:35:56] <geckosenator> yeah
  • [02:35:59] <geckosenator> the static is annoying
  • [02:36:10] <geckosenator> I need to figure otu how to make it talk faster too
  • [02:36:16] <geckosenator> since if I do something like ping a host
  • [02:36:22] <geckosenator> it takes it longer than a second to read teh reply
  • [02:36:26] <geckosenator> so it can't keep up
  • [02:36:27] <Russ> You'll need to eliminate the static before you deliver your mythtv work too
  • [02:36:41] <geckosenator> I don't care about mythtv
  • [02:36:48] <geckosenator> do you notice the static?
  • [02:37:04] <geckosenator> I might be able to fix it with some resistors and capacitors
  • [02:37:09] <geckosenator> or at least improve it
  • [02:37:50] <djlewis> My audio is clear playing a text mp3 on my web site.
  • [02:38:16] <djlewis> a vocal mp3 I should have said.
  • [02:38:34] <djlewis> is it in the text to speech translation routine?
  • [02:39:17] <geckosenator> could be
  • [02:40:13] <djlewis> I've played with several and they are not all created equal.
  • [02:40:29] <geckosenator> I'm using festival lite
  • [02:40:40] <geckosenator> since I don't have a hardware synthesizer
  • [02:40:50] <geckosenator> do you know a better one?
  • [02:41:29] <djlewis> you could try flite, I dunno though.
  • [02:42:01] <djlewis> oh flite = festival lite?
  • [02:42:02] <geckosenator> yes
  • [02:42:13] <geckosenator> already using it :-P
  • [02:42:16] <djlewis> there is espeak too.
  • [02:42:25] <geckosenator> oh
  • [02:42:43] <geckosenator> yeah I can try it
  • [02:43:06] <djlewis> while you are at it you might add PocketSpinx so you can talk to it.
  • [02:43:23] <djlewis> let me know how well they work as I will be going there soon.
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  • [02:44:16] <geckosenator> why do you care?
  • [02:44:53] <djlewis> I told you, I will be working with speech and voice recognition along with visual navigation.
  • [02:44:54] <geckosenator> the sound quality seems fine
  • [02:45:01] <geckosenator> for playing mp3
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  • [02:45:32] <djlewis> so it is the code or timers for speech. you might just convert text to mp3 then play it.
  • [02:45:49] <djlewis> I know, overhead..
  • [02:46:05] <djlewis> My weather server software does that though.
  • [02:46:21] <Severian> The BeagleBoard is interesting, but too expensive for me. Is there a less expensive version in the works? I don't expect it to get down to Arduino levels, but closer would help.
  • [02:46:54] <Russ> thats too bad
  • [02:46:58] <djlewis> stop smoking and save up ;)
  • [02:47:21] <geckosenator> espeak doesn't seem to work
  • [02:47:23] <Russ> but looking back, the beagle board is such a bargain compared to what has been available to hobbists over the past several years
  • [02:47:44] <Russ> Severian: you could get an old ipaq on ebay
  • [02:47:50] <djlewis> yep russ, i agree. I studied it long and hard and I have a BB now.
  • [02:48:08] <geckosenator> it works on my x86 system
  • [02:48:13] <geckosenator> but it's broken completely on the beagle
  • [02:48:39] <djlewis> I'll try it.
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  • [02:48:45] <Severian> I don't smoke or drink alcohol. I would buy 8 arduinos and have 8 projects going for the price of one BeagleBoard. The BeagleBoard is cheaper than some development systems, but it is not in the hobbying price range.
  • [02:49:05] <Severian> I don't say this to criticize. I am curious.
  • [02:49:10] <Russ> Severian: I really disagree, I can remember buying a tuxscreen back in the day
  • [02:49:18] <Russ> and attempting to assemble a lart before that
  • [02:49:55] <Severian> What do you disagree with? $149 is way more than $18.
  • [02:50:00] <Russ> Severian: if you need to go on the cheap, get a used system that has linux ported to it
  • [02:50:07] <djlewis> geckosenator: did you get the 'libjack' messages during install?
  • [02:50:17] <Russ> tuxscreen was $199 iirc
  • [02:50:30] <djlewis> compare apples to oranges.
  • [02:51:22] <geckosenator> djlewis: it installed it
  • [02:51:41] <Severian> So, I will take it the answer to my question is no, and I should ignore the Beagle Board for now. Thank you for your assistance.
  • [02:51:48] <djlewis> geckosenator: mine installed it now I need to figure how to use it.
  • [02:51:54] <Russ> I can buy a microcontroller for $1
  • [02:52:09] <Russ> Severian: thansk
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  • [02:52:50] <djlewis> hmmm, I thought it was apples vs oranges :)
  • [02:53:21] <Russ> I know, if a microcontoller is sufficient, than beagle is probably not a good fit for someone on such a small budget
  • [02:54:00] <djlewis> Hopeful I guess. Maybe when the omap with nand is available on the cheap.
  • [02:54:50] <Russ> lets see...8kb flash for $18, or 262144kb for $149
  • [02:56:06] <geckosenator> well
  • [02:56:16] <geckosenator> djlewis: I can't get espeak to work at all on the beagle
  • [02:56:25] <geckosenator> djlewis: and on my x86 it talks.. but it says the wrong thing
  • [02:56:28] <djlewis> geckosenator: I dont think it installed for me. I cant find it.
  • [02:56:31] <geckosenator> where flite works on both
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  • [02:56:37] <geckosenator> I did apt-get install espeak
  • [02:56:40] <geckosenator> and it installed it
  • [02:57:13] <djlewis> i opkg'd it.
  • [02:58:10] <geckosenator> ok
  • [02:58:17] <geckosenator> then you can do stuff like
  • [02:58:21] <geckosenator> espeak "hello there"
  • [02:58:35] <djlewis> it didnt install, cant find it.
  • [02:58:50] <geckosenator> oh
  • [02:59:01] <geckosenator> well on my x86 machine it talks
  • [02:59:07] <geckosenator> and on the beagle it just blocks
  • [02:59:52] <Russ> maybe some alsa driver problem?
  • [03:00:05] <djlewis> I installed something (speech) on my x86 the other day but I forgot its name.
  • [03:00:06] <geckosenator> I doubt it
  • [03:00:26] <geckosenator> I can hear it click
  • [03:00:31] <djlewis> When I opkg espeak it trys to load libjack
  • [03:00:31] <geckosenator> when you run it
  • [03:00:39] <geckosenator> well I"m not using angstrom
  • [03:01:59] * sakoman (n=sakoman@static-74-41-60-154.dsl1.pco.ca.frontiernet.net) Quit ("Leaving")
  • [03:03:22] <djlewis> ok, it installed the second time.
  • [03:04:16] * ddompe (n=ddompe@ip2-28-10-190.ct.co.cr) Quit ()
  • [03:04:56] <djlewis> sakoman: I meant to ask you something before you left ...
  • [03:08:47] <djlewis> geckosenator: all i get is a pop,, static spurt....pop with "this is a test"
  • [03:09:02] <djlewis> mp3 plays purty.
  • [03:09:12] <djlewis> ls
  • [03:09:44] <Animule> heh, "spurt"
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  • [03:12:22] <djlewis> geckosenator: looks like Festival will convert text to mp3 or to speech
  • [03:15:37] <djlewis> hmm.. festival not on angstrom list.
  • [03:17:24] <bobkatzz> Hello - got a BB serial cable question - can you use a serial/USB adapter to do the communication to BB or does it have to be that special "AT/Everex" type that Digikey sells? tnx
  • [03:18:22] <djlewis> i'm using a usb to serial with the null modem cable and the everex db9 to header.
  • [03:19:43] <bobkatzz> so its <usb>---------<<serial>><<db9>>-----------<<10pinheader>> ?? is that 2 cables?
  • [03:20:27] <djlewis> takes the everex 10-pin header to get off the board, a null modem cable to cross pins 2 and 3 and the usb to serial to get into your pc.
  • [03:20:38] <djlewis> three parts
  • [03:20:44] <bobkatzz> wondering why I can't go from serial port on pc to unused USB on BB?
  • [03:20:56] <djlewis> you can go to the OTG
  • [03:21:18] <bobkatzz> ok - then I have to solder that jumper on J6?
  • [03:21:24] <bobkatzz> to turn on TOG?
  • [03:21:30] <djlewis> the serial port and OTG are defined for console management as I understand it.
  • [03:21:32] <bobkatzz> otg b^)
  • [03:22:02] <djlewis> also the OTG can be ethernet to the BB via software
  • [03:22:46] <bobkatzz> that would be much better but I do have a 10 pin header with cable attached and a serial plug so I could make that cable that Digikey sells myself but = lots of work if this OTG will work
  • [03:23:10] <djlewis> I get confused on the OTG's use.
  • [03:23:20] <djlewis> Perhaps someone will chime in.
  • [03:23:53] <bobkatzz> me too and I'm really new at this - alos - while I have your attention, hehe - I got no audio out when I powered up the board
  • [03:24:03] <djlewis> geckosenator: no matter how I try the espeak, it is just noise. bummer.
  • [03:24:28] <bobkatzz> I did get a nice pic of the beagle on the monitor though
  • [03:24:38] <djlewis> good. this is a good thing.
  • [03:24:42] <bobkatzz> so I know something's working B^)
  • [03:25:00] <jkridner|work> u-boot on Rev B makes noise, but Rev C does not.
  • [03:25:11] <djlewis> You could boot all the way without a console with a DVI monitor attached. You will need a powered usb hub on the EHCI port.
  • [03:25:15] <jkridner|work> the noise delayed the boot, so we removed it.
  • [03:25:26] <bobkatzz> no audio is really a bummer since my project involves hooking the BB up with a SDR ham radio irg
  • [03:25:27] * Russ (i=foobar@ip70-176-249-242.ph.ph.cox.net) Quit ("Ex-Chat")
  • [03:25:33] <djlewis> I've never heard sound during boot on revC either.
  • [03:25:36] <jkridner|work> would still have audio.
  • [03:25:43] <bobkatzz> ok cool
  • [03:25:57] <djlewis> cool with me too.
  • [03:25:59] <jkridner|work> just not during the boot of u-boot.
  • [03:26:00] <bobkatzz> I have RevC
  • [03:26:13] * emeb (n=ericb@ip72-223-90-212.ph.ph.cox.net) has left #beagle
  • [03:26:17] <jkridner|work> what is confusing about OTG use?
  • [03:26:44] <djlewis> bobkatzz: here is your moment.
  • [03:26:56] <bobkatzz> nothing - I just have been over so many scenarios now I need to back up one step and go over that part again
  • [03:27:33] <bobkatzz> oh - ok I just want to be sure I understood what that means and that I have to solder that jumper on J6
  • [03:28:22] <bobkatzz> also it has to do with whether you are using the USB for power or as a host (in my case it will be a host)
  • [03:28:31] <bobkatzz> coorecto?
  • [03:29:08] * bass (i=dad2d6dd@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-6754e67e556fa457) Quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
  • [03:29:25] <bobkatzz> I'm using the USB/tiny cable right now so the USB port is free
  • [03:29:58] <bobkatzz> USB-mini that is
  • [03:30:22] <bobkatzz> was that my moment?
  • [03:31:16] <bobkatzz> hope my confusion didn't proliferate same, heh
  • [03:32:31] <djlewis> I dont know what happened with jkridner|work, I thought he was going to address your question
  • [03:32:41] <bobkatzz> usb-mini for power that is
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  • [03:32:55] <bobkatzz> that's ok it looks like he may be at work
  • [03:33:01] <bobkatzz> so that comes first
  • [03:33:23] <djlewis> i've never used the OTG but I think there are two cable types a 5p and 6p
  • [03:33:58] <djlewis> or am I confused again...?
  • [03:34:22] <djlewis> one OTG cable sets host mode without doing the jumper.
  • [03:34:41] <djlewis> the jumper is for the other cable.
  • [03:35:20] <bobkatzz> well - I will re-read that part since I'm pretty sure that I'll be running in host mode and powering the BB from a separate source and using the USB port for the transceiver
  • [03:36:17] <djlewis> either way, it will plug into the usb on PC and be detected and all is good :) pardon my lack of knowledge on the subject.
  • [03:37:02] <bobkatzz> ah ok I do remember reading about two cables. that's much better than soldering on the BB - although I should be pretty bold after building the SoftRock v6.3 (google that!)
  • [03:37:03] <djlewis> I use serial console and a powered hub for kybd, wifi, mouse etc.
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  • [03:37:24] <djlewis> sounds familiar.
  • [03:37:27] <bobkatzz> yeah that will be necessary too
  • [03:38:11] <bobkatzz> I'm still not even sure that the Linux software will operate the radio so I'm in a real Twilight Zone hehe
  • [03:38:45] <bobkatzz> I'll have to run Linrad that has been compiled for Ubuntu ARM
  • [03:39:10] <bobkatzz> that has been done but not with the SR RXTX
  • [03:39:36] <bobkatzz> and I have a presentation of the whole thing on Friday HAHAHAHAHAHAH!
  • [03:39:54] <bobkatzz> a deep hole I have dug
  • [03:40:00] <djlewis> interesting hardware. may the force be with you on the presentation.
  • [03:40:03] <jkridner|work> djlewis, just have lots of distractions.
  • [03:40:40] <djlewis> jkridner|work: I just dont know enough to answer his questions on OTG.
  • [03:41:05] <jkridner|work> you shouldn't need to solder anything.
  • [03:41:15] <bobkatzz> oh ok - we were digressing from the OTG thing - I will be running in host mode so djlewis was saying there is an OTG cable so you don't have to solder J6
  • [03:41:30] <bobkatzz> lag heh
  • [03:41:43] <jkridner|work> bobkatzz: that is for people who use the wrong cable.
  • [03:41:58] <jkridner|work> yeah, just lots of other things going on, so I don't read the whole log.
  • [03:42:08] <bobkatzz> ah - so which cable is the right one?
  • [03:42:18] <jkridner|work> depends if you want host or device mode.
  • [03:42:39] <bobkatzz> host for sure
  • [03:42:44] <jkridner|work> mini-A is right for host mode. mini-B is right for device mode.
  • [03:43:07] <bobkatzz> so I'll be using the mini port?
  • [03:43:25] <jkridner|work> OTG is the mini port.
  • [03:43:28] <bobkatzz> and then powering via the usb hub or power supply +5v
  • [03:43:58] <bobkatzz> ah ok - sorry I've benn going over all this today in and it's kind of washed over me
  • [03:44:36] <bobkatzz> ok so how do you "sex" a mini cable to find out which it is?
  • [03:44:39] <jkridner|work> have you read the BBSRM?
  • [03:44:51] <jkridner|work> (system reference manual)
  • [03:45:25] <djlewis> jkridner|work: he said he wanted to use it in console mode without serial port earlier.
  • [03:45:28] <bobkatzz> I read most of that yeah - but in fast mode - a lot was pretty detailed so dropped back to the "newbie startup" page B^)
  • [03:45:52] <djlewis> to save on cables.
  • [03:46:03] <jkridner|work> wouldn't that be in device mode then?
  • [03:46:21] <djlewis> I'm thinking so.
  • [03:46:51] <jkridner|work> so a standard mini-B cable with the A port going to a PC or hub.
  • [03:46:59] <djlewis> bobkatzz: am I correct about your goal?
  • [03:47:12] <bobkatzz> well I'm not sure about that but I will read further - yeah this will be an entirely stand-alone SDR rig
  • [03:47:23] <jkridner|work> depending on how the image is configured that is being booted, that goal should be possible.
  • [03:47:23] <bobkatzz> with the BB as the computer (host??)
  • [03:47:36] <jkridner|work> Rev C board?
  • [03:47:40] <jkridner|work> Rev C has 2 USB ports.
  • [03:47:41] <bobkatzz> and the radio communicating via the two audio cables and usb
  • [03:47:47] <bobkatzz> yeah RevC
  • [03:48:26] <jkridner|work> so, I suspect you are talking about connecting one USB port to a PC and the other USB port to something like a USRP (or some other xcvr).
  • [03:49:10] <bobkatzz> there will not be any other PC - in this case the BB is functioning as the PC and running the Software defined radio software (Linrad)
  • [03:49:57] <bobkatzz> so it "tunes" the radio via the usb and then receives and transmits via the audio in/out
  • [03:50:43] <jkridner|work> oh. If the BB acts as host, why not just use the standard USB A-type connector?
  • [03:50:59] * jkridner|work starts to fall asleep after a long day.
  • [03:51:02] <bobkatzz> the rig has an onboard Si570 variable oscillator and an AT/Tiny Pic chip that work in conjunction with a PCFilter for each band
  • [03:51:11] <bobkatzz> yeah me too
  • [03:51:30] <bobkatzz> so thanks for some clarification and I'll read up on the OTG thing
  • [03:51:48] <jkridner|work> k. hope I didn't make it more confusing and I wish you much success.
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  • [03:52:28] <bobkatzz> the main thing is that I think I see that it will work and that I just need a better understaining of that part
  • [03:52:54] <bobkatzz> I was worried about the sound though and that is very good news - !
  • [03:53:21] <bobkatzz> if you're around tomorrow I'll keep you posted on the progress
  • [03:53:44] <djlewis> I understand it records and plays back audio just fine. I have been playing mp3 clearly.
  • [03:53:56] <bobkatzz> and I'm tracking the project on my Facebook page for the folks in my Tech class
  • [03:54:09] <djlewis> The BB diagnostics runs you through sound tests.
  • [03:54:12] <bobkatzz> cool
  • [03:54:19] <djlewis> its a document
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  • [03:54:40] <bobkatzz> the audio is pretty important part of the success of SDR
  • [03:55:06] <bobkatzz> so I'm preparing to maybe have to get an external sound card
  • [03:55:16] <djlewis> why?
  • [03:55:51] <bobkatzz> but it would be nice to keep the entire thing in the target 3" x 6" x 2" 3d footprint
  • [03:56:15] <bobkatzz> hope to add a touchscreen and eliminate the kewyboard and mouse - Phase II hehe
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  • [03:56:32] <djlewis> PsP sharp is popular.
  • [03:56:55] <bobkatzz> oh just if the sound card is not adequate but I have no reason to think it won't
  • [03:57:07] <djlewis> do try it first.
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  • [03:57:30] <bobkatzz> yeah the hams use RigBlasters but those puppys are a couple hundred bucks
  • [03:57:53] <bobkatzz> but if you have a $1500 radio that's not a big deal
  • [03:58:09] <bobkatzz> I'm strictly QRP (under 5 watts)
  • [03:58:59] <bobkatzz> but I got from here (Richmond, VA) to Warren, OH (320+miles) on about 1 watt - kewl
  • [03:59:35] <djlewis> I see "Ham radio" the lower wattage stuff that more as glorified CB, no offense.
  • [04:00:14] <djlewis> if it wasnt skip or repeaters then it is doing something.
  • [04:00:53] <bobkatzz> actually it's the other way around - anyone can buy a $1500 radio with a mike and talk to people all over the world - THEY are the ones that are the most like CB'ers
  • [04:01:18] <djlewis> I only enjoyed the morse code portion of ham land.
  • [04:01:26] <bobkatzz> us guys with 5 watts running CW (that Morse Code) get 100 watts of distance per watt of their voice
  • [04:01:39] <djlewis> chatting on phone or radio is not my thing.
  • [04:02:05] <bobkatzz> now that the FCC abolished the requirement for code - it's the new hot deal!! hehe
  • [04:03:00] <bobkatzz> a fairly competant person can learn to send and receive 15 words a minute in about 2 weeks if they really go for it a couple of half hour sessions a day
  • [04:03:53] <bobkatzz> I teach Cub Scouts 25% of the alphabet in about 20 minutes and I've bumped into kids that I taught last year and they still remember it
  • [04:04:19] <bobkatzz> the brain is the best demodulator in the universe!
  • [04:06:12] <bobkatzz> we now have digital modes and software that will decode from your receiver if you miss a couple of letters so you run that while your operating and that way you don't have to panic
  • [04:07:03] <bobkatzz> and the old guys that can copy 60wpm say that watching the decoder with it's 1 second lag time is the bset way to learn how to copy in your head really fast - haven't tried that yet
  • [04:07:25] <bobkatzz> so anyway - off to reading and thanks again
  • [04:07:40] <djlewis> I hope it all works out for U.
  • [04:08:15] <bobkatzz> I think it will - just have to be persistant
  • [04:08:50] <bobkatzz> but assistance is a good thing (as Martha would say - it a good thing!)
  • [04:09:27] <bobkatzz> later
  • [04:09:51] <djlewis> geckosenator: I couldn't get espeak to work but flite file to wav them mplayer wav works well.
  • [04:12:38] * j_ack_ is now known as j_ack
  • [04:13:01] <djlewis> geckosenator: I dont get static using flite for direct speech.
  • [04:18:17] <ds2> 5W?!
  • [04:18:44] <ds2> <1W is more interesting
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  • [04:29:32] <djlewis> ds2: like tha guy with 6 jars of bleach for batteries and a rig?
  • [04:30:23] <ds2> djlewis: got a link?
  • [04:30:31] <ds2> I like QRP operation
  • [04:31:48] <djlewis> it was posted in teh irc last week I think by mru I think.
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  • [04:38:33] <geckosenator> djlewis: ok
  • [04:38:38] <geckosenator> djlewis: well it's not static
  • [04:38:49] <geckosenator> djlewis: just when the voice starts and stops there are "bumps" not sure what it's called
  • [04:39:14] * jrmuizel (n=jrmuizel@CPE001f5be79d0f-CM0017ee62f8b0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) Quit ()
  • [04:39:14] <geckosenator> djlewis: I like espeak better from the sound of it
  • [04:39:18] <djlewis> its a beagle thing. Mine does it with most audio start and after.
  • [04:39:32] <djlewis> did you get BB espeak going?
  • [04:39:39] <geckosenator> no
  • [04:39:43] <geckosenator> it works on my laptop
  • [04:39:52] <geckosenator> but not with emacs yet
  • [04:39:55] <geckosenator> not sure what I did worng
  • [04:42:58] <djlewis> yep a loud pop a few seconds after audio source stops
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  • [04:45:05] <djlewis> ds2: found it in my history.. http://www.hanssummers.com/radio/homebrew/battery/index.htm
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  • [05:01:12] <djlewis> ping ds2:
  • [05:01:39] <ds2> ?
  • [05:01:46] <djlewis> get the link?
  • [05:01:59] <ds2> gave up searching
  • [05:02:07] <djlewis> look up three lines
  • [05:02:56] <djlewis> ds2: found it in my history.. http://www.hanssummers.com/radio/homebrew/battery/index.htm
  • [05:06:14] <ds2> hmmm
  • [05:06:27] <djlewis> sounds like ya got it now.
  • [05:06:32] <ds2> yeah
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  • [05:36:29] * djlewis says time for sleep. goodnight...
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  • [06:19:59] <methril|work> good morning
  • [06:26:34] <AV500> gm
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  • [06:32:59] <favor> hi. how to modify the kernel version when builld Angstrom distro in oe recipes?
  • [06:33:57] <raster> pants
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  • [06:37:37] <favor> does anyone know? thanks
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  • [07:02:30] <mpoullet|work> good morning
  • [07:03:50] <Animule> crap, it is 0100 already :(
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  • [08:15:04] <ajp> hi my mplayer doesnt work and i get a segmentation fault error can anyone help me out to fix this error
  • [08:18:24] <AV500> we can try if you give more info
  • [08:19:25] <ajp> ok i have X-Loader 1.41,U-Boot 1.3.3,Kernal 2.6.28, my board version is B7
  • [08:19:49] <ajp> my environment variables are bootcmd=mmcinit; fatload mmc 0 0x80300000 uImage; bootm 0x80300000 bootargs=console=ttyS2,115200n8 console=tty0 root=/dev/mmcblk0p2 rootdelay=2 rootfstype=ext3 rootwait omapfb.video_mode=1024x768MR-16@60 omapfb.vram=2M,4M,4M y
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  • [08:21:24] <ajp> pwd
  • [08:22:43] <ajp> the log file shows an erroe code 139 was returned from mplayer
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  • [08:27:22] <ajp> you need any other info?
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  • [09:05:38] <hrw> morning
  • [09:05:43] <mru> morning
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  • [09:13:35] <psykes> angstrom-distribution.org down, or is it just me?
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  • [09:33:50] <mpoullet|work> ibot: seen ddompe
  • [09:45:37] <jkridner|work> good morning all
  • [09:45:52] <hrw> hi jkridner
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  • [11:28:56] <mocramis> hi all
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  • [11:29:44] <mocramis> does it exist an exact physicall description of the beagleBoard
  • [11:29:51] <mocramis> ?
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  • [11:37:26] <AV500> beaglebord.org
  • [11:37:30] <AV500> www.beagleboard.org
  • [11:37:49] <AV500> http://beagleboard.org/static/BBSRM_latest.pdf
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  • [12:30:19] <maelcum> i wonder how the openembedded patches work... i've used the 2.6.29 patchlist to create a shellscript that applies them.
  • [12:30:39] <maelcum> some patches try to create files that exist, something patch really doesn't like, even with -f.
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  • [12:32:30] <maelcum> or maybe my kernel checkout is dirty, let's see
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  • [12:39:21] <maelcum> yes, that was it
  • [12:39:53] <maelcum> iommu support, do i want that?
  • [12:41:19] * elesueur (n=elesueur@120.16.142.85) Quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
  • [12:41:23] <mru> no
  • [12:41:30] <mru> the omap doesn't have one
  • [12:41:44] <mru> the dsp has its own mmu but that's a different thing
  • [12:42:54] <mocramis> does it exist an exact physicall description of the beagleBoard ? I mean with the components precise positions ? the general datasheet doesn't has it...
  • [12:45:14] <mru> there should be detailed schematics available somewhere
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  • [12:47:04] <tor2> iirc there's a link in the SRM to the actual data files (back where the layout is described)
  • [12:47:30] * tor2 fires up xpdf
  • [12:48:44] <tor2> Hmm.. it mentions 'Gerber files' and 'Allegro source files'. That's probably just the PCB layers.
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  • [12:57:31] <maelcum> thanks mru. i've found a mail indicating that somewhere on gmane but it's better to know for sure.
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  • [13:00:18] <maelcum> the oe patch list for 2.6.29 looks crazy (very long). i wonder how long it will take to get all that into -omap and then mainline... 2.6.32?
  • [13:00:52] <hrw> maelcum: yes. linux-omap in OE has the largest set of patches
  • [13:01:12] <hrw> maelcum: but you prefer to not see patchset for android beagleboard kernel
  • [13:02:02] <maelcum> hehe... i've heard that they are doing a few things that will *never* be accepted in mainline.
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  • [13:05:23] * maelcum compiles the oe patched 2.6.29-omap1 and hopes for the best
  • [13:05:45] <maelcum> is the latest u-boot required for something?
  • [13:06:05] <maelcum> mine is maybe 4-6 months old
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  • [13:20:40] <geckosenator> maybe
  • [13:21:05] <geckosenator> I would recommend a newer uboot
  • [13:22:16] <mru> I'm using u-boot from january without issues
  • [13:22:36] <mru> I may have patched it slightly
  • [13:22:39] <mru> can't remember
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  • [13:27:56] <maelcum> kk. i'll get the latest version when i get around to it...
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  • [14:40:34] <geckosenator> freaking future timestamps
  • [14:40:39] <geckosenator> magnet__: can you stop doing that
  • [14:41:43] <magnet__> sorry, I got some networks troubles, seems fixed now
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  • [16:31:56] <Kithera> Howdy All
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  • [17:52:57] <Crofton|work> sakoman_, ping
  • [17:54:38] <Batko_Marto> hey guys. I have yet another problem with webcams. I just got another beagleboar - rev. C2 and tried streaming 2 webcams. I keep getting the following error though:
  • [17:54:43] <Batko_Marto> cannot submit datapipe for urb 0, error -28: not enough bandwidth
  • [17:54:50] <Batko_Marto> gspca: usb_submit_urb [0] err -28
  • [17:54:59] <Batko_Marto> gspca: no transfer endpoint found
  • [17:55:21] <Batko_Marto> any ideas?
  • [17:55:41] <sakoman_> Crofton|work: pong
  • [17:55:49] <Batko_Marto> this is supposedly on the High speed usb port through a usb 2.0 hub
  • [17:56:10] <Crofton|work> are the gpio mux settings enough to permit the gpio to be used in either direction?
  • [17:56:37] <sakoman_> which gpio mux settings in particular?
  • [17:56:43] <Crofton|work> u-boot
  • [17:56:53] <Crofton|work> the mmc2 ones on the expansion connecotr
  • [17:57:19] <sakoman_> which machine, beagle?
  • [17:57:26] <Crofton|work> yeah
  • [17:57:51] <Crofton|work> I can read data from spi, need to make sure the gpios work next
  • [17:57:56] <Crofton|work> need to write a driver
  • [17:58:19] <sakoman_> one moment, I'll look
  • [18:00:06] * mrc3 (n=ddiaz@189.157.113.43) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [18:00:41] <Crofton|work> heh
  • [18:00:49] <Crofton|work> I really need to understand this muxing
  • [18:00:56] <Crofton|work> the comments in u-bbot are not helpful
  • [18:01:03] <sakoman_> Crofton|work: looks like they are all set up for generic gpio, reads & writes should work
  • [18:01:13] <Crofton|work> ok
  • [18:01:20] <sakoman_> you can test with /sys/class/gpio
  • [18:01:28] * rbelem-lunch is now known as rbelem
  • [18:01:29] <Crofton|work> so they default to read unless you configure them as outputs?
  • [18:01:44] <Crofton|work> yes, I am afraid of driving the FPGA versus the Beagle :)
  • [18:02:03] <sakoman_> don't know! I always set them up explicitly
  • [18:02:04] <ds2> Crofton|work: put in buffers so those are the things that blow
  • [18:02:15] <Crofton|work> heh
  • [18:02:18] <Crofton|work> too late for that
  • [18:02:35] <ds2> by default, they are read only... you need to ask for writecapability; this assumes IEN is enabled obviously
  • [18:02:47] <Crofton|work> thanks ds2
  • [18:03:07] <Crofton|work> I have the fpga set as input, except for the spi ones
  • [18:03:18] <Crofton|work> but I need to start addin gthe interupt line back to beagle
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  • [18:04:02] <ds2> make it safe
  • [18:04:15] <ds2> use a open drain on the FPGA side
  • [18:04:26] <ds2> and pull it up with the 1V8 IO voltage
  • [18:04:45] <ds2> it'll give you a wired or instead of a conflict
  • [18:05:07] <Crofton|work> good idea
  • [18:05:27] <Crofton|work> I'll have to see if my fpga/pinumx fu is good enough :)
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  • [18:17:09] <mpoullet|home> ddompe_: ping
  • [18:18:22] <Batko_Marto> anybody has an idea why 2 webcams work fine with musb and usb1.1 hub and give bandwidth problems with the EHCI port and usb 2.0 hub?
  • [18:19:17] <Crofton|work> are they usb2.0 cams?
  • [18:19:53] <Batko_Marto> the both get detected as 1.1 full speed
  • [18:20:07] <Batko_Marto> if i stream only one it works fine
  • [18:20:17] <Batko_Marto> when i try to stream both i can't
  • [18:23:47] * khasim (n=a0393720@192.163.20.231) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
  • [18:27:25] <Batko_Marto> any clue?
  • [18:28:27] <Crofton|work> no
  • [18:28:31] <Crofton|work> anything in logs?
  • [18:28:35] * Oiler (i=d98c6e17@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-be78211291e85126) has joined #beagle
  • [18:28:56] <Batko_Marto> zc3xx: probe 2wr ov vga 0x0000
  • [18:28:56] <Batko_Marto> [ 1933.129760] cannot submit datapipe for urb 0, error -28: not enough bandwidth
  • [18:29:09] <Batko_Marto> and the second line keeps repeating for a long time
  • [18:29:23] <Batko_Marto> until this:
  • [18:29:30] <Batko_Marto> gspca: usb_submit_urb [0] err -28
  • [18:29:30] <Batko_Marto> gspca: no transfer endpoint found
  • [18:31:14] <Oiler> Got a question for you guys - I'm running full Ubuntu on my Beaglem, and wanted to know if there are ARM compilation tools I can use for some lightweight, native development, just to run something like Hello World, or run and benchmark NEON code.
  • [18:31:45] * john__ (n=john@77-99-69-49.cable.ubr16.haye.blueyonder.co.uk) Quit ("Leaving")
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  • [18:33:43] <Kithera> Oiler: Assuming you're doing compilation for beagle on beagle, the install the build essential package and get your c on
  • [18:34:03] <Kithera> Nothing special if you're creating for the local enviroment.
  • [18:34:14] * robtow (n=rtow1@nat/montavista/x-464f7cd6fc2c509f) Quit (Remote closed the connection)
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  • [18:37:08] <Oiler> Thanks Kithera - do you happen to know if these tools support ARMv7 (NEON)? I have to download and install that seperately, correct?
  • [18:39:10] <Kithera> As far as I know, with proper -march flags (I'm not sure what these are, anyone care to elaborate), normal gcc will happily do Arm7, including the neon instruction set.
  • [18:39:43] <mru> -mcpu=cortex-a8 -mfpu=neon -float-abi=softfp
  • [18:40:41] <Kithera> There you go, right from the expert himself
  • [18:40:54] <Oiler> I wonder if I have enough room on my 256MB Beagle for doing native building under full Ubuntu on Beagle?
  • [18:41:32] <Kithera> If you're asking if you have enough ram, the short answer is "maybe"
  • [18:41:42] <Oiler> LOL
  • [18:41:46] <Kithera> drop yourself out of X would help.
  • [18:42:02] <Kithera> And have a good sized swap to make the difference.
  • [18:42:34] <Kithera> As a side example, I'm currently doing a build world on my Asus EEE 1000ha with 1GB of ram, but I rarely use more than 300MB.
  • [18:42:55] <Kithera> And that's with X, XFCE, and Audacious going as well.
  • [18:44:21] <Oiler> thanks for the info, I guess I'll try and see. The apps I'd be compiling would be relatively small, I'm just worried about the size of the tools
  • [18:45:00] <Kithera> What are you using for primary storage? An SD card? 4GB or better?
  • [18:45:23] <Oiler> 8 GB SD card
  • [18:45:33] <Oiler> thats what I'm running Ubuntu off of
  • [18:45:56] <Kithera> Installing via Synaptic will tell you how much more space build essential will take up, but from a default Ubuntu install, I doubt it would be more than 30-40MB
  • [18:46:02] <Oiler> well, a 4GB partition
  • [18:47:03] <Oiler> ah, that should worl
  • [18:47:05] <Oiler> work
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  • [18:47:37] <eFfeM> Batko_Marto: i think there are still some issues with the ehci driver
  • [18:47:39] <Oiler> so what the easiest way to install build essential from my Beagle?
  • [18:47:45] <eFfeM> i've seen different problems with it
  • [18:47:46] <mark_uk> evening all - anyone offer any good books to get started with extending and building with the beagleboard
  • [18:48:19] <Kithera> Oiler: build essential is a standard Ubuntu Package, make sure you have all your repositories turned on, it will show up in synaptic
  • [18:49:13] <mark_uk> or general learning sources! :)
  • [18:50:33] <Kithera> Odd, the ubuntu packages page doesn't list the arm arch for any of their packages.
  • [18:50:34] <Kithera> http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/devel/build-essential
  • [18:50:37] <Batko_Marto> I just tried streaming the webcams from my laptop through the usbhub and it fails the same way
  • [18:50:42] <Kithera> it might not be available.
  • [18:51:54] <Oiler> hmm
  • [18:52:49] <Oiler> but if I'm running on top of an ARM, shouldn't it compile for ARM?
  • [18:52:54] <Batko_Marto> i'm getting the following on my laptop end in the logs:
  • [18:52:56] <Batko_Marto> zc3xx: probe 2wr ov vga 0x0000
  • [18:52:56] <Batko_Marto> May 5 14:50:01 MARTO [15474.941062] ehci_hcd 0000:00:1d.7: iso sched full ffff880034855400 (now 3191 max 11383)
  • [18:52:56] <Batko_Marto> May 5 14:50:01 MARTO [15474.941069] gspca: usb_submit_urb [0] err -28
  • [18:53:23] <Batko_Marto> if I use 2 different ports - no problem
  • [18:53:52] <geckosenator> hi
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  • [18:53:58] <Kithera> packages aren't built on download, at least not be default.
  • [18:54:09] <geckosenator> what about source packages?
  • [18:54:14] <geckosenator> are you running ubuntu on the beagle?
  • [18:54:22] <geckosenator> I have debian on mine
  • [18:54:31] <Kithera> Oiler wants to do some basic compiling
  • [18:54:35] <Oiler> I'm running Ubuntu
  • [18:54:54] <Kithera> I told him to install Build Essential, and get his C on
  • [18:55:11] <Oiler> I want to compile some Hello World or benchmark NEON natively under Ubuntu
  • [18:55:22] <geckosenator> hello world on neon?
  • [18:55:25] <geckosenator> isn't neon a fpu?
  • [18:55:46] <geckosenator> how did you install ubuntu on the beagle?
  • [18:55:47] <Oiler> hello world OR NEON stuff
  • [18:55:49] <mru> neon is a vector unit
  • [18:55:52] <muriani> if you're in ubuntu on the beagle, apt-get install build-essential should get the tools you need
  • [18:55:54] * jimsheldon (n=jim@c-98-216-198-0.hsd1.nh.comcast.net) has joined #beagle
  • [18:55:56] <mru> both float and integer
  • [18:56:12] <muriani> provided they have the toolchain in the repo, which they shold
  • [18:56:12] <geckosenator> oh
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  • [18:56:21] <muriani> it wouldn't be a proper release otherwise
  • [18:56:22] <jimsheldon> has anyone else experienced a "popping" sound a couple seconds after playing an audio file on the beagle board?
  • [18:56:23] <geckosenator> mru: but not 64bit floats?
  • [18:56:28] <geckosenator> jimsheldon: yes
  • [18:57:32] <mru> geckosenator: depends
  • [18:57:43] <jimsheldon> geckosenator: oh really? is it documented anywhere?
  • [18:57:49] <mru> neon and vfp use the same register file
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  • [18:58:00] <geckosenator> mru: can you emulate 64bit floats on it?
  • [18:58:14] <geckosenator> it would be about 10x slower, but I read somewher eyou can emulate 64bit floats using 32bit ones
  • [18:58:17] <Oiler> geckosenator: http://elinux.org/BeagleBoardUbuntu
  • [18:58:58] <mru> the vfp unit does scalar 64-bit floats
  • [18:59:05] <geckosenator> oh
  • [19:03:32] <geckosenator> do how does gcc do vectorizing stuff?
  • [19:03:39] <mru> badly
  • [19:03:53] <Kithera> lol
  • [19:03:57] <geckosenator> heh
  • [19:05:28] <john3909> OE is giving me a build error (http://pastebin.com/m54c1c59e) when I do a bitbake beagleboard-demo-image. Any ideas on how to fix this?
  • [19:06:30] <john3909> Oops, wrong window.
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  • [19:19:03] <Kithera> mru: do you know when gcc added -mcpu=cortex-a8?
  • [19:19:42] <Kithera> It seems a lot of guides are still stating -mcpu=arm7t (or worse )
  • [19:21:20] <mru> 4.3
  • [19:21:37] <mru> the codesourcery releases had it earlier
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  • [20:11:47] * Crofton|work does not miss the u-boot noise ...
  • [20:14:42] <Batko_Marto> hey guys, I'm getting this at boot with a usb hub connected to musb and then usb dies.
  • [20:14:44] <Batko_Marto> musb_init_controller failed with status -19
  • [20:15:01] <Batko_Marto> how can i find out what the status -19 means
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  • [20:20:49] <hrw|gone> bye
  • [20:22:17] <Oiler> Hello, I have a newbie question - if I'm natively compiling and running code under Ubuntu on Beagle using gcc, that code is running on the hardware, not in a simulation, correct?
  • [20:26:53] * Wowbagger_ (n=wowbagge@d154-20-156-61.bchsia.telus.net) has joined #beagle
  • [20:29:39] <Kithera> Unless you're doing something really weird, then yes. You are running native code on the processor.
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  • [20:36:46] <Batko_Marto> I also noticed that i get this error at boot before the uncompressing of the image happens
  • [20:36:48] <Batko_Marto> Error, the USB hardware is not on B mode
  • [20:36:56] <Batko_Marto> what is that supposed to mean?
  • [20:38:19] * Xerion (i=xerion@82.170.197.160) has joined #beagle
  • [20:40:46] <Kithera> In general usb mode a means host, mode b means client.
  • [20:41:17] <Batko_Marto> ah ok so it just states that it's in host mode
  • [20:48:42] * Neozed (i=4dc5b5fc@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-099578f51aa4820c) has joined #beagle
  • [20:48:53] <Neozed> hi
  • [20:51:01] <Neozed> I just need some help to use the beagleboard with DLP :D
  • [20:51:42] <Neozed> I'm running angstrom with 2.6.26 kernel and I'm not able to change the resolution of the DLP
  • [20:56:50] * mpoullet|home (n=mpoullet@77-22-121-59-dynip.superkabel.de) has left #beagle
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  • [20:59:27] <djlewis> ping sakoman_
  • [20:59:30] <Kithera> Command line or X, Neozed?
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  • [21:03:00] <Oiler> so is arm-elf-gcc not part of build-essential?
  • [21:04:32] <Neozed> command line :)
  • [21:04:42] <Oiler> or do I not need that if I'm natively building on Beagle?
  • [21:07:44] * eFfeM (n=frans@195-241-226-180.ip.telfort.nl) Quit ("Leaving.")
  • [21:10:46] <Kithera> oiler: no, that is only needed for cross compiling, for native compiling you just need "gcc" which actually maps to about the same thing.
  • [21:11:00] <Kithera> Neozed, then I don't know.
  • [21:11:47] <Oiler> cool, I got it working, but I can't seem to generate NEON instructions
  • [21:13:19] <Kithera> a) did you use mru's build flags, and (b) how do you know there is no neon in your executable?
  • [21:13:43] <Neozed> ok thank you Kithera ! :)
  • [21:13:46] <Neozed> anybody else ? :p
  • [21:14:03] <Kithera> and (C) are you compiling code where it would make since to use SIMD instructions?
  • [21:14:20] <Oiler> yep, I used those flags, and I generated a listing file, I don't see any NEON. I'm trying to vectorize loops
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  • [21:17:56] <Oiler> its code ARM's compiler will vectorize, maybe it just doesn't recognize it as well
  • [21:18:04] <Kithera> Well, it seems to me you're doing everything right. Maybe you're generating code that gcc just can't vectorize, or it think's you should.
  • [21:18:21] <Kithera> that is, gcc thinks you shouldn't
  • [21:19:00] <Oiler> right
  • [21:19:26] <Oiler> is there any known C samples I can use that it can vectorize?
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  • [21:22:47] <ds> are there powervr-based codecs available?
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  • [21:44:20] <muriani> powervr-based codecs?
  • [21:44:37] <muriani> I thought all the acceleration was done via NEON or the DSP
  • [21:46:15] <Kithera> I'm sure there is some sort of generic open gl acceleration for gst, that with a proper drive could be pushed to the power vr chip. But I don't think said driver exists.
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  • [21:46:40] <Kithera> There ARE patches which let you use the DSP, which is probably the better way to do it anyway.
  • [21:46:48] <Oiler> Kithera: thanks, I found an example in the groups that got me some NEON
  • [21:46:54] <ds> powervr sgx contains video decoding hardware. it's unclear whether this made it into the omap silicon and/or there are drivers for the hardware available
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  • [21:47:13] <Batko_Marto> I'm trying to get my rev C2 board to auto boot. For some strange reason it doesn't work
  • [21:47:30] <Oiler> By the way, is there a GUI version of build-essential?
  • [21:47:52] <Kithera> ? Like a full ide?
  • [21:47:57] <Kithera> umm, sorta
  • [21:48:04] <Oiler> yeah, kinda
  • [21:48:05] <Batko_Marto> i followed the directions in the elinux.org/beagleboard, save the env and when i restart i'm back to square one
  • [21:48:26] <Kithera> Eclipse (java based), Anjuta (Gnome) or KDevelope
  • [21:48:43] <ds2> ds: what kind of video decoding hw?
  • [21:48:45] <Kithera> Those will get you close to something Visual Studio ish
  • [21:48:58] <Kithera> But they will take a LOT more resources.
  • [21:49:17] <Oiler> gotcha
  • [21:49:22] <Kithera> And none of them pretend to be like VS, so expect a bit of a learning curve.
  • [21:49:43] <Kithera> 300MB to 1.5GB install sizes.
  • [21:50:00] <Oiler> by the way, when I try to run my exectuble, I get a seg fault everytime
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  • [21:50:13] <Kithera> There is also one I like, called code blocks, but that is not in any of the official repositories.
  • [21:50:36] <Kithera> Gonna head home, talk to ya'll latta.
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  • [21:54:59] <Oiler> Anyone have any idea why I'd get a segfault trying to run a simple executable natively built with gcc under Ubuntu? I wonder if I need to configure a memory map
  • [21:55:16] * like2wise (n=likewise@82-171-51-231.ip.telfort.nl) has joined #beagle
  • [21:56:03] <ds2> yes, you have violated some constraint set forth by the MMU and as a result, the MMU generated a fault which in turn cause the kernel to shutdown your app with a signal SEGV.
  • [21:56:33] <ds> ds2: apparently I'm confusing powervr VXD and SGX. I remember seeing powervr linked specifically with video codecs at some point, but i doubt that is authoritative
  • [21:57:03] <ds2> ds: any idea which codecs though?
  • [21:57:26] <ds> VXD does h.264, mpeg4 asp, vc-1, mpeg2
  • [21:57:36] * maelcum (n=horst@78.52.138.99) has joined #beagle
  • [21:57:50] <ds2> Oh... Hmm
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  • [21:58:00] <maelcum> hey, 2.6.29-omap1 with oe patches seems to work flawlessly so far. that's great.
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  • [21:58:32] <Oiler> thanks ds2, what is the most common violation of the MMU? It's probably what I'm doing :)
  • [21:58:56] <ds2> accessing a wild pointer?
  • [21:59:43] <Oiler> I'm building the middle post C here: http://groups.google.com/group/beagleboard/browse_thread/thread/2ca91dbe2d2ac335
  • [22:02:08] <Oiler> nevermind, it's working now
  • [22:02:56] <Oiler> anyone know how I can benchmark code using build-essential?
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  • [22:06:53] <maelcum> time ./compiled_program in the simplest case
  • [22:08:42] <ds> ds2: do you happen to know if the "video hardware accelerator" part of the IVA is documented?
  • [22:09:37] <ds2> ds: that I donno... never seen docs on the IVA at all
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  • [22:29:05] <mru> ds: there are no public docs on the video hardware accelerator
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  • [22:44:25] <ds2> mru: are there non-public ones?
  • [22:45:03] <mru> of course
  • [22:46:13] <geckosenator> ?
  • [22:46:15] <ds2> just wanted to distinguish between not openly discloses vs not disclosed outside of the original company
  • [22:48:44] <maelcum> a propos public / not public: codesourcery's 2009q1 release is not listed on their website but the tarballs are on the webserver.
  • [22:48:55] <maelcum> they have directory listing enabled in the download dir :)
  • [22:49:50] <mru> the HWA consists of an ARM968 core controlling accelerators for motion estimation, loop filter, and variable-length code decoding
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  • [22:50:11] <mru> there's also some local memory
  • [22:50:41] <mru> and a connection to the IVA internal interconnect
  • [22:53:59] <_don_> hello everyone -- am I still better off booting the kernel from an SD card, or is using tftpboot via a USB-ethernet pretty workable now? Haven't seen anything promising while digging.
  • [22:55:26] <maelcum> strange - for me booting off sd card is easier anyway (it also contains the root fs though...)
  • [22:58:40] <_don_> I prefer tftpboot because it makes switching between projects easier.
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  • [23:42:02] <ds> mru: ah, that's where the hidden arm5 core fits in
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  • [23:46:37] <Downix> Hmm
  • [23:47:06] * Downix wonders if anyone makes a stripped down arm cpu?
  • [23:47:27] <maelcum> two transistors?
  • [23:50:45] <maelcum> there are so many arm chips from many manufacturers
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